The Dreamers

[tpfkabi]

so you're saying that Venus shot above was digitally altered?
they did quite a job then!

[Thrindle]

And lastly I think we need to give this 'expert in the art of canoodling' thing a rest. Canoodle was a charming word when we first introduced it to xixax, but now the word's getting overplayed and losing its novelty. Peace.

*Pat's Chest's head* It's OK, really. I understand where you're coming from. I almost got mad and acted in a vindictive manner, but see, if this matter really has no importance to XIXAX at all... in your opinion, then why reply to my thread with such a tone? I think I know the answer... and not to butt heads... but, its jealousy. It really is.   :P

I've made no attempt to pride myself on being the champion of canoodling (well... maybe a little), but merely to reply to what everyone else says about me. So please, lay off and just allow me a sense of personality and uniqueness on the board - just as everyone else here seems to have.  Replying like you did does a disservice to everyone on the board, not just canoodlers like me.

[grand theft sparrow]

*Pat's Chest's head* It's OK, really. I understand where you're coming from. I almost got mad and acted in a vindictive manner, but see, if this matter really has no importance to XIXAX at all... in your opinion, then why reply to my thread with such a tone? I think I know the answer... and not to butt heads... but, its jealousy. It really is.   :P

I've made no attempt to pride myself on being the champion of canoodling (well... maybe a little), but merely to reply to what everyone else says about me. So please, lay off and just allow me a sense of personality and uniqueness on the board - just as everyone else here seems to have.  Replying like you did does a disservice to everyone on the board, not just canoodlers like me.

Classy as always, Thrindle.  Kudos!  

[Stefen]

and not to butt heads... but, its jealousy. It really is.  

And he's jealous of what? That he's not the xixax cyber slut?

[Thrindle]

And he's jealous of what? That he's not the xixax cyber slut?

I hope your manhood has been validated for today.

[Chest Rockwell]

so you're saying that Venus shot above was digitally altered?
they did quite a job then!

Yes, I think I've decided to use that one. Thanks!

And Thrindle, I don't know what you're talking about. You presented an opinion. I disagreed, presenting my own personal opinion of the film briefly. I never once undermined your opinion of it by insisting it be wrong or by insulting your intelligence or anything.

And the canoodle comment wasn't directed at you specifically. The whole board has been using it a little too excessively. You just happen to be the entity with which its most associated on this board, so I put the comment under your use of it. You seem to think I'm attacking you, but really I'm not. And despite your 'efforts' to not reply vindictively, I can't help but notice you mocking me during your entire post, for whatever reason. Anyways, sorry.

[Stefen]

And he's jealous of what? That he's not the xixax cyber slut?

I hope your manhood has been validated for today.

Look at you, "validating" my point by mentioning my manhood.  :laughing2:  :laughing2:  :laughing2:

[Pwaybloe]

the worse part is when he starts "getting into it" and over acts the song like hes performing in a high school battle of the bands.......

Yeah.  And then Bertolucci cuts to the producer, who's getting into it, and hey, look over here... the bassist is getting into it.  And, hey, don't forget to cut to Michael looking like a New Kid on the Block strutting down the street.

[Pubrick]

so you're saying that Venus shot above was digitally altered?
they did quite a job then!

Yes, I think I've decided to use that one. Thanks!

And Thrindle, I don't know what you're talking about. You presented an opinion. I disagreed, presenting my own personal opinion of the film briefly. I never once undermined your opinion of it by insisting it be wrong or by insulting your intelligence or anything.

And the canoodle comment wasn't directed at you specifically. The whole board has been using it a little too excessively. You just happen to be the entity with which its most associated on this board, so I put the comment under your use of it. You seem to think I'm attacking you, but really I'm not. And despite your 'efforts' to not reply vindictively, I can't help but notice you mocking me during your entire post, for whatever reason. Anyways, sorry.

classy as always, chest. kudos.

u've come a long way.  

[cron]

who'll be the brave individual that'll give kudos to stephen (and call him classy)

[Finn]

Just finished watching this. Terrific movie. Toward the end I got a little impatient with the brother and sister and kept wondering how the movie was gonna end. But the ending makes sense and works for the movie and characters.

[Mellow Fellow]

anybody else feel like the ending was playing on matt's saying that the director is like a criminal, the whole voyeurism thing, and that ending the movie right there without resolving a whole lot of issues was  sort of bertolucci getting the hell out of there, you know, fleeing the scene of the crime before he got caught?

[Finn]

SPOILER WARNING!

I'm not sure how much association the ending has with the director's personal beliefs or him as a person. But I think the ending works because of the characters and their belief systems. Eventually their political differences gets in the way of their relationship. The main theme (or moral) of the movie is that you can't change people. The Michael Pitt character tries to change the brother and sister's relationship by taking her out on a date and making everything normal. He also tries to change their political way of thinking too. But none of it works. She wants to stay with her brother and doesn't want their relationship to change. And at the end of the movie the brother and sister run into the violence because they want to and the Michael Pitt character walks away from the violence because he wants to.

[Chest Rockwell]

anybody else feel like the ending was playing on matt's saying that the director is like a criminal, the whole voyeurism thing, and that ending the movie right there without resolving a whole lot of issues was  sort of bertolucci getting the hell out of there, you know, fleeing the scene of the crime before he got caught?

SPOILERS
I don't think so. I agree more with Insomniac. The reason it ended so abruptly was that the 'dream' was shattered, literally and figuratively, by that rock from the outside world. The reason it's called The Dreamers is that the kids are dreaming within their little apartment, and turning away from what's happening outside--their eyes are closed. The thing is that Matthew, removed from the enclosed world of the twins, is more conservative than they. When he makes love to Isabelle he more or less succumbs to their world, though he knows what he's doing is wrong, which leads him to try and change them. It doesn't work. The parents witness them naked on top of each other, and when Isabelle realizes they found out, she tries to kill herself (remember when she told Matthew 'I'd kill myself' when asked what she would do if the 'rents were to find out?'). Then suddenly it's all interrupted by that stone from the outside world, and they finally escape the dream. Matthew isn't as outspoken (liberal, whatever) as Theo, so he walks away. Theo wants to fight the good fight, so he throws the molotov cocktail. Isabelle just doesn't want to leave Theo, since she's had him her entire life and is so closely bound to him that she never wants to leave him, so she stays with him. At least that's how I saw it.
SPOILERS

[modage]

I finally saw the Dreamers though. It was a pretty bad film overall. Interest to the situation where the three people explore sex so casually didn't elevate it beyond the very unbelievable plot set up. When Eva Green got naked, I was happy. By the last time she got naked, I was tired of seeing her body. Too much casual nudity for even a soft core porno. Of course, the film was trying to be more.

Artistically, I saw a love letter to 60s cinema beyond the characters quoting films. Almost all the situations seemed to mirror one film or another. The dramatic threesome tangle mirrored Jules et Jim, the exploration of sex Last Tango in Paris. Eva Green seemed like she was hired on the spot because she replicated Jeanne Moreau so well (role was written for a young Moreau anyways). The first sex scene where blood was rubbed over the face hinted at Cries and Whispers. The dramatic purposes was different in both films, but the same in the effect of shock and awe.

I really enjoyed the movie at the beginning when it was running though the history and life of times I frankly wish I was apart of. It was a great feeling of nostalgia. Then the film did try to become something but in the lackluster story of what I thought was an easy way to explore sex, I saw conventional set ups and pretensious ideas. There was no heart at the center of this film that intrigued me.

wow, thats exactly how i feel.  bertoluccis 0 for 2 for me.  it was porno for cinephiles.  after a while watching these kids with no responsibilities sit around and do whatever the hell they wanted to just made me sick.  like, if you're hungry, did you ever consider getting a job?  theyre eating out of the fucking trash waiting for another check to show up?  i hate these people.  the ending was also pretty lazy and pointless.

I thought it a beautiful film and aside from that I found it fun trying to catch all the references (besides the obvious ones).

can you even call it a film 'reference' if theyre actually showing you the clips from the other movies?  i mean, how could you miss it?  by going to the bathroom?

just keep in mind you're getting the censored butchered rated R version (made specifically for Blockbuster video), not the NC-17 version that went to theatres.

I saw the NC-17 version in the theater, and I saw the R-rated version (courtesy: Blockbuster) a couple days ago.  For those that are worried, there was not much cut out.  I was guessing about 30-45 seconds.
SPOILER There was nothing integral to the plot that was cut.  The closeups of Matthew's penis, sex, bloody kiss were shortend but not cut.  END SPOILERS

on a personal note, i wish i had seen the R rated version.  i hate michael pitt and now i've seen his genitals.