Broken Flowers

[RegularKarate]

Finally saw this... fantastic film... In reaction to most of what Mod has said (I think GB covered a lot and I agree with almost all of it except the "hundreds of times better than Sideways" part... and no, I don't think they should be compared at all)

annoying thing #1: calling the character Don a "Don Juan" about 3 times in the first 10 minutes.  WE GET IT, could you be any more obvious?

I hate saying this sort of thing, but this makes me think you DIDN'T get it... it's not that they're trying to tie him to DJ, he's being constantly reminded of this at the begining and it's not something he enjoys.

annoying thing #1 part II: once that got tired, he thought having every character remark on the name Don Johnston as to be confused with Don Johnson.  HILARIOUS right?!!  especially when everyone does it and it's the most obvious joke you could go for!

every character?  you mean two? and it's called a "running gag" and it was pretty mildly used.

annoying thing #2: giving bill murray the worst performance of his career...

I have said for years that BM is PERFECT for a Jarmusch film and not in the way he was used in C&C, in the way he was used in this.  and he's great.

I understand why people don't get into Jim's movies, but if you LIKE his films (and I think he's great), you'll probably like this one.

[grand theft sparrow]

Since I live in the same area as mod, he might actively try to fight me.

This is my favorite film so far this year.  I swear to God, I had a smile on my face the whole time.  This is my idea of a feel-good movie.  

Jarmusch just has a negative effect on some people.  A friend of mine had a similar reaction to mod's with Ghost Dog, saying it was the worst movie he'd ever seen, etc.  It happens.

I agree with everything RK said except that I agree with Ghostboy that it was better than Sideways, which I didn't connect with at all, but I don't want to get into that now.  

But Bill Murray should lay off the mid-life crisis movies for a bit.  He did a great job here but after Lost in Translation, Wes Anderson's films, and this, I don't know that there's anywhere else for him to go with this kind of character.

[Pubrick]

i wonder if the reviews would be so positive if mod hadn't hated it so vehemently.

[modage]

Yes, once I got to this part I thought, oh, Jarmusch just ain't his cup of tea.  But if you knew what his movies are and how much you dislike and are annoyed by them, why be so harsh in your review?  Hell, why go see the movie in the first place for that matter?  
I just don't get it.  Just like you don't get ol' stubborn Jim.

because i hadn't formed a solid opinion of Jarmusch yet and i wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt.  i've seen 7 of Jarmusch's 9 films (all but Mystery Train and Permanent Vacation) and never hated one till now.  they all ranged from not-very-good to kinda-good.  i was hoping with the ridiculously good reviews and with murray involved, he might be able to pull off a 'good'.  so it was with that, that i went in with expectations low but looking to be surprised.

Do you not like Jarmusch either, P?
He's not for everyone, seriously... and I can totally understand it... I don't even think it's a matter of "getting it"... I just think it's not everyone's thing.
I can't make "excuses" for why I love Ghost Dog or Down by Law... I just do... there's no need to make excuses in my eye, but at the same time, I can understand why some people think I'm just some pretensious asshole that's pretending to like them... they just don't like it.

yeah, i like this.  

Are you talking about that Pavement analogy RegularKarate?  Because I as well thought that was an awful, awful analogy and was way over the top.  If there weren't hundreds of Pavement copycat bands trying to sound like Pavement and failing I would understand the comment, as Pavement would be some horrible fluke.  But they're obviously appealing to a niche, and, aside from the slacker mindset that they shepherded, you'd be hard pressed to find a musician who doesn't respect them and think they're talented.
So yeah.  Maybe Jarmusch is the Pavement of directors.
No but obviously the kicker was that modernage doesn't like any of Jarmusch's movies.  I just thought that analogy was terrible and made it transparent that modernage has a mindset which is antithetical to the one that mirrors Jarmusch's.

i realize Pavement is appealing to a niche, the same way that Jarmusch appeals to a niche, and for me its the perfect analogy.  for years, under their reputations i have tried and tried to give each of them a shot but (as RK said) they're just not my thing.  and i don't think it's that i don't get it, because seriously listen to Pavement.  it's almost like he's allergic to writing a good song the same way Jarmusch is allergic to making a movie that appeals to a wider audience.  Jarmusch could have progressed in 25 years as a director and the only thing standing in the way of that is himself.  

When people say, 'This film's more commercial than your others,' I want to reach for a gun.  What does that mean, 'It's commercial'?  Have I failed?

it's almost sad that someone in his 50's is clinging so desperately to this idea of cool.  and i'm not saying he should make a more 'commericial' movie to be better.  what i'm saying is, when you read PT talking about his films in interviews, he hopes they do 100 mill, he gives his audience the benefit of the doubt, he hopes he has made something that people will like.  that doesn't mean he's compromised his vision, it just means he isnt TRYING to make films for a niche audience, thats just the way it works out.  Jarmusch, so aware of what it is to be 'indie', sets out to do just that, thus lowering the bar for himself to a completely reachable height.  

I'll take issue with two of Modage's critique's (ignoring the unqualifiable 'Jarmusch can't direct' comment).

i never said he can't direct.  i said he's just not very good at it, but i think he's a much better director than a writer.  

I've noticed that one bad review lends itself to a mob mentality of bad reviews on Xixax. Glad to hear you had a great experience Ghostboy. I'm going to see this in the next couple of days.

so does a good one.  that's what my review was trying to prevent, but atleast now people who do love it will have to explain why beyond...
"loved it.   murray was great.  best of the year!" cause after Huckabees, i can't deal with that again...

beautiful, beautiful film.

care to elaborate?

annoying thing #1 part II: once that got tired, he thought having every character remark on the name Don Johnston as to be confused with Don Johnson.  HILARIOUS right?!!  especially when everyone does it and it's the most obvious joke you could go for!

every character?  you mean two? and it's called a "running gag" and it was pretty mildly used.

i realize its a running gag.  its just not a very good one, its like sub-MadTV level humor.  really, like most things in the script it seems like it was tossed off with minimal effort perhaps in hopes of capturing something more spontaneous.  really, how many parts of this movie are laugh out loud funny?  perhaps a few minor chuckles, but hearty guffaws are not something jarmusch excells in (unless he gets steve coogan and alfred molina involved and just lets them go!).  if the funniest thing you can come up with is having a character named lolita appear naked (because that did get the biggest laugh at my screening) and cutting to murray stone-faced, then i think we're in trouble.  

Since I live in the same area as mod, he might actively try to fight me.

i will fight you.

[mutinyco]

Yeah! Brawl at Hell Gate Bridge!

[grand theft sparrow]

i will fight you.

A nozh scrap any time you say.  

[Eddo]

I just saw this movie today, and it is terrific. It's a very quiet film and moves at a calm pace, and yet it is so funny and involving. Bill Murray's performance is incredible, right up there with Lost in Translation and Rushmore. A great character study, where most of what you learn about the central character comes from secondary characters. Julie Delpy was underused, though. And I do agree that while Murray is amazing at these types of roles, he should probably move on to something a little different for his next project(s).

[grand theft sparrow]

modage will fight you.

[fulty]

I really liked this film.

So...when can we start with the spoilers..??

[modage]

SPOILER

this movie sucks.

[Kal]

SPOILER

this movie sucks.

thats a spoiler everyone should hear before going to see it

[squints]

Stephen Malkmus died for our sins and I will not tolerate this blasphemy

[Alethia]

jarmusch sucks.

except mystery train.

[Pubrick]

jarmusch sucks.

except mystery train.

u make a compelling argument.

[matt35mm]

But Bill Murray should lay off the mid-life crisis movies for a bit.  He did a great job here but after Lost in Translation, Wes Anderson's films, and this, I don't know that there's anywhere else for him to go with this kind of character.

And I do agree that while Murray is amazing at these types of roles, he should probably move on to something a little different for his next project(s).

Garfield II, anyone?