Million Dollar Baby

[cine]

FUCK! another waaayyy overrated clint eastwood movie. goddamn it

well at least Mesh talked about it.. any genuine reasons why you think this?

[ono]

Three good articles (thanks, cine), all with massive spoilers:

Critics have no right to play spoiler
'MDB': Asking some hard questions
Critics are fighting it out: It's 'Baby' vs. 'Sideways'

[El Duderino]

FUCK! another waaayyy overrated clint eastwood movie. goddamn it

well at least Mesh talked about it.. any genuine reasons why you think this?

SPOILERS

well....
A) i thought clint eastwood's acting was horrendous. it was like he was just spitting out the words, as opposed to really getting into it.
B) the cliches: clint eastwood's estranged daughter. swank's mom hates her, but she sends her money anyway.
C) the score....bleck
D) i walked in with really high expectations, and i was really dissapointed

[Thrindle]

SPOILERS
well....
A) i thought clint eastwood's acting was horrendous. it was like he was just spitting out the words, as opposed to really getting into it.

If you haven't noticed, Clint Eastwood has a style about him that often seems terse... maybe a little forced.  Having said this, he did an amazing job in Million Dollar Baby.  For a man as closed up as his character was, the small quiver of his bottom lip was enough to show exactly what was going on inside.  He was understated and brilliant.

B) the cliches: clint eastwood's estranged daughter. swank's mom hates her, but she sends her money anyway.

That's a cop-out.  Everything is cliche, nothing is new.  In fact, just saying that is cliched.  
Clint Eastwood's estrangment would have been cliched if we'd have known why.  As for the mother, she was not a cliche.  Why?  Because the scene where she tells Hilary Swank that everyone is laughing at her, is sheer brilliance.  It is perfect becasue you can see the hatred and the self loathing that goes on inside a person, as they spit venom on someone else.  That was not cliched.  
What would have been really cliched if....  

Hilary Swank had lost to the Blue Bear and then come back to win.  This film did not even touch that.  Not even close.  

For that reason I'd say that although the movie hinges on cliche, it is not cliched to the point of fault.  

C) the score....bleck

The score didn't take away from the movie, so what is the issue with it?

D) i walked in with really high expectations, and i was really dissapointed

I don't get it.  You are looking for reasons to dislike this movie.

[SHAFTR]

Wow, Eastwood is like a good wine.

Best movie of the year.  If this sweeps the oscars, i'd be happy.  I betcha Marty yelled, "FUCK" after he saw this.  I don't want to say too much about it.  Cinephile had it right when he told me the less you know about this movie coming in, the better.

[matt35mm]

I saw this and The Aviator tonight.  Both good movies.  I, however, must say that I think Million Dollar Baby is the better film.  The Aviator has greater flashes of brilliance, some which match or outshine anything else in 2004, but Million Dollar Baby was the overall better film.

SORTA SPOLIERS

That said, I just know that I have to watch it again.  There was more than I could take in one viewing because the movie went in SUCH a different direction in the last half hour.  Perhaps a part of me couldn't fully get into it because I was still thinking about what I thought about what happened.  I need to watch it again without those "OMGWTF" feelings in my chest and just enjoy the movie.

Also, about in the middle of the movie, I've never wanted to hug movie characters more than I wanted to hug Maggie and Frankie.

[Pozer]

the score is nearly exactly the same as it is in mystic river. i kept thinking. i've heard this score before.

No way. Mystic had a haunting piano theme and was a remedy of this old song i used to hear in church...'father, I adore you. lay my life before you.'
Baby's had this accoustic strum that had an old school vibe about it. A unique choice.
Thrindle, your post was genuine.

[artfag]

This film by Clint Eastwood starring himself, Hilary Swank, and Morgan Freeman is being renowned as one of (if not) the best films of the year.
I am inclined to agree for several reasons.

First of all, the acting in this film was incredible.  Most overlooked I think of all, was Morgan Freeman as the caretaker of the gym and narrator of the story.  A powerful performance portraying passion, struggle, and uncertainty by Clint Eastwood was also notable.  However, these performances are overshadowed by the undeniably fantastic performance of Hilary Swank, the somewhat uneducated, middle-aged, female boxing prospect.  I think without the acting, this film would not have accomplished what it did, but still would have a purpose.

That purpose, of course, was created by Clint Eastwood's amazing visualization in the direction of this film.  Doing what Raging Bull and Rocky failed to do, Clint Eastwood takes us into the mind of a boxer and teaches us what it means to fight for something no matter how large the struggle.  He does this with a combination of things.  First, he uses character actions to show that every move a boxer makes is part of a strategy and, like any other sport, the person with the most precision in their strategy will win.  Secondly, his choice of shot, a brilliant combination of close ups in the ring to medium shots ring side, to overhead shots in ring show how important it is to see things from all angles.

That, to me, is what this film is all about.  Seeing things from all angles.  When I saw this movie, I was expecting nothing more than a movie about a boxer with great acting.  To my great pleasure, I received not only that, but an angle that I had never seen from this type of movie prior.  As opposed to only teaching us things through what the character's say, he teaches us a lot through their action and what we see from the outside as well.  This was a fantastic film and I would recommend it to anyone.  It is truly one of the ten best of last year.[/b]

[Dtm115300]

This is pretty cool. I got screener dvd copys of Millon Dollor Baby, Ray, and The Avaitor today. All perfact copys for award voting. Im gonna watch Million Dollor Baby tonight.

[matt35mm]

Oh also, I wanted to say that this is one of the strongest love stories I've seen as well this year.  Different, but as powerful.

[SHAFTR]

I've been to a few (kick)boxing matches and I feel that MDB captured what its like to be ringside and everything in a simple way.  It works perfectly.

[Jeremy Blackman]

PARALYZING SPOILERS


What a stupid movie.

The more I think about it, the less I like it. It just crumbles.

The last part was pretty magical, yes... I walked out thinking "Hey, maybe that was a good movie." But when I wiped the tears from my face and remembered the first part, I felt really empty.

The twist might have made me happy had it subverted the first part, but it only justified it.

This movie is far more political than I think most people are willing to admit. It's basically the American Dream vs. the Welfare Queen. Face it, that was a coldly manipulative sidestory, and the Welfare Queen is one of the most ridiculous and offensive caricatures I've seen in a long time. And this little social commentary is really the heart of the story, if you think about it. That was Maggie's accomplishment. She "made it." That's where all the meaning is. She worked hard, she made it big, and she was grateful, but the Welfare Queen took handouts and reacted with irrational cartoonish resentment. That's the fantasy dichotomy this whole thing is based on? Wonderful.

The "mo cuishle" thing was also pretty coldly manipulative. It's the only thing that kept me hanging on through the long boring stretch. Also, I assumed it meant "my daughter," so the reveal (though in a great scene) was a little disapppointing.

Before the accident, this movie was a assembly line of clichés. There was even a training montage. Clint Eastwood must now officially be the king of obnoxious heavy-handedness. The first part of the movie was just like the "you're the king and this is your kingdom" scene from Mystic River. The Maggie character was one-dimensional from the beginning and never changed. She's persistent and loyal. That's it. All of her non-paralyzed scenes had the nuance of a boxing glove beating the message into my skull one punch after another. "Hey, look at me! I'm persistent! Nope, I'm not going away, boss!" Thanks, I got it the first time.

Clint Eastwood's character irked me from the very beginning as well, and I never really like him until he became a euthanasiast. She's 31 and he calls her "girlie." He's a cold-hearted bastard. Sure, there are reasons for it, but he's still a cold-hearted bastard. His macho grizzled rhaspy voice made his redeemable cold-hearted bastard character even more ridiculous. And the Morgan Freeman narration didn't help him. You know Clint Eastwood was just trying to channel The Shawshank Redemption. Lazy. So his character, at best, is a cold-hearted bastard, very stubborn and very masculine, whose heart is ready to be partially melted by a replacement daughter figure. Profound.

I thought Morgan Freeman had the most interesting character. His "110th fight" scene was pretty great. But I'm sure if Eastwood had spent more time on him he would have turned out just as one-dimensional as the other two.

Anyway, it really is lazy mechanical storytelling. There are so many gimmicky plot devices. There's the lame "mo cuishle" mystery, which mechanically strung me along when nothing else did. There's the lemon pie, which is supposed to be a sentimental cue. There's that stupid speed bag, which is supposed to be symbolic of personal responsibility/integrity/ownership or something. There are the letters, which symbolize Frankie's stubbornness and futile habits. I don't know... this object-oriented character development really doesn't work for me.

Add to all this the absolute unredeemability of boxing, and I don't find much to like in this movie.

[ono]

So basically, if you were me, this would be your "Closer."

SPOILERS

You really shouldn't say "PARALYZING SPOILERS" ... that's kind of rude, though funny, even if you don't like the movie.

Many people are admitting this film is political.  That's what one of those articles I posted a link to is about.  People are perceptive, but they're also whiners.  Republicans hate it.

I didn't think any part of the movie was manipulative because it was so matter-of-fact about everything.  The only problem I saw in it was with the family, because they were so one-dimensional, but their one-dimensionality was necessary.  You can break down pretty much any movie into the objects that move the plot along, so that's a kind of strawman reason to dislike it.

I never really liked or appreciated boxing until this movie.  I'm very anti-violence.  But afterwards, I was able to appreciate it much more.  Again, it shows how different people respond to movies differently.  There will be backlash, there will be haters.  All great movies tend to polarize audiences in one way or another.

Here's a question.  Take Ebert for example.  He goes into great detail as to why this movie is amazing.  How would you respond to his points?  I'd have more of my own, but when I see a movie, usually only an overall feel lingers (much how PTA and LVT said they take in movies), so I have trouble discussing extreme specifics unless I've just seen the movie.  It sounds to me a bit like you went in to hate it (your knee jerked a bit at the "girlie, tough ain't enough" line from the trailer, when most agreed it's not as bad as you make it out to be).

[RegularKarate]

JB's taking far too much offense to the film's mild right-wingedness (oooooh how DARE a film have just a little HINT of conservative though... seriously, it's not that bad).  I KNOW that mother, so it's a stereotype, yes, but one that's very true and I don't see it the way you're seeing it (which I think is a biased viewpoint... you're mad at Clint for saying he would kill Michael Moore <-yes, I'm kidding).

This film isn't nearly as good as Unforgiven, but it does the same thing.  It takes the cliched genre film and shows you the other side of it.

[ono]

Wait a second... this film is extremely liberal in my eyes -- that's why it's got republicans pissed.  Where do you see right-wingedness?