Sideways

[Myxo]

The guy is an alcoholic and the movie never once addresses him getting treatment. Instead he hooks up with an enabler. How's that for an upbeat ending?

[matt35mm]

The guy is an alcoholic and the movie never once addresses him getting treatment. Instead of hooks up with an enabler. How's that for an upbeat ending?

I know ya jokin' (sorta), but one of the points of the movie, I thought, was that there is such a thing as the socially acceptable "classy" drunk.  I mean, Miles is an asshole when he's drunk (well, more of an asshole than he is when he's sober, that is), and there's nothing classy about that.  But he's a wine connoisseur, and even though he gets drunk just like everyone else, it feels strange to ask a wine connoisseur to get some treatment.

And Miles doesn't drink to get drunk, he just doesn't know his limits.  He drinks and drinks and drinks.  That's an economic way of telling you something about him as a person--the mofo doesn't know his limits.  He's a live-in-the-moment guy who doesn't really think so much about the future, which explains why he takes Jack out on this trip despite not being able to afford it (so he steals from his mom).  Jack thinks a little about his future, like what he's gonna do with Christine's dad's business and how he can move to Wine Country but still drive to auditions in L.A. etc.  They're childish plans, somewhat, but he's someone who's always gotten away with childish plans (he managed to be a working actor, he manages to fuck a lot of girls, all of these childhood dreams have come true for him).

But being middle-aged doesn't stop these two from acting so childish, and that's one of the points of the movie, I think.  I know it's a somewhat obvious thing for me to point out, but that's my explanation for why he drinks somewhat irresponsibly and gets to make that his lifestyle, basically.  The adult world is a whole lotta pretense.  Icky, icky pretense.  But they're learning, and that's what the movie's about.

[sickfins]

1.6 billion pennies

[Myxo]

The guy is an alcoholic and the movie never once addresses him getting treatment. Instead of hooks up with an enabler. How's that for an upbeat ending?

I know ya jokin' (sorta), but one of the points of the movie, I thought, was that there is such a thing as the socially acceptable "classy" drunk.  I mean, Miles is an asshole when he's drunk (well, more of an asshole than he is when he's sober, that is), and there's nothing classy about that.  But he's a wine connoisseur, and even though he gets drunk just like everyone else, it feels strange to ask a wine connoisseur to get some treatment.

And Miles doesn't drink to get drunk, he just doesn't know his limits.  He drinks and drinks and drinks.  That's an economic way of telling you something about him as a person--the mofo doesn't know his limits.  He's a live-in-the-moment guy who doesn't really think so much about the future, which explains why he takes Jack out on this trip despite not being able to afford it (so he steals from his mom).  Jack thinks a little about his future, like what he's gonna do with Christine's dad's business and how he can move to Wine Country but still drive to auditions in L.A. etc.  They're childish plans, somewhat, but he's someone who's always gotten away with childish plans (he managed to be a working actor, he manages to fuck a lot of girls, all of these childhood dreams have come true for him).

But being middle-aged doesn't stop these two from acting so childish, and that's one of the points of the movie, I think.  I know it's a somewhat obvious thing for me to point out, but that's my explanation for why he drinks somewhat irresponsibly and gets to make that his lifestyle, basically.  The adult world is a whole lotta pretense.  Icky, icky pretense.  But they're learning, and that's what the movie's about.

This movie ends the same way Monster's Ball ends. You think all is well when the credits start rolling, but later realize that the characters aren't in much better shape than they were when the movie started. I'll write more and explain further in the article I am writing for the green room on Sideways soon.

[Pubrick]

wait, so ur writing a negative review of this for the green screen?

[Myxo]

wait, so ur writing a negative review of this for the green screen?

Nope.

I'm writing why I loved the film. There's nothing wrong with an ending which doesn't tell everything.

[matt35mm]

The guy is an alcoholic and the movie never once addresses him getting treatment. Instead of hooks up with an enabler. How's that for an upbeat ending?

I know ya jokin' (sorta), but one of the points of the movie, I thought, was that there is such a thing as the socially acceptable "classy" drunk.  I mean, Miles is an asshole when he's drunk (well, more of an asshole than he is when he's sober, that is), and there's nothing classy about that.  But he's a wine connoisseur, and even though he gets drunk just like everyone else, it feels strange to ask a wine connoisseur to get some treatment.

And Miles doesn't drink to get drunk, he just doesn't know his limits.  He drinks and drinks and drinks.  That's an economic way of telling you something about him as a person--the mofo doesn't know his limits.  He's a live-in-the-moment guy who doesn't really think so much about the future, which explains why he takes Jack out on this trip despite not being able to afford it (so he steals from his mom).  Jack thinks a little about his future, like what he's gonna do with Christine's dad's business and how he can move to Wine Country but still drive to auditions in L.A. etc.  They're childish plans, somewhat, but he's someone who's always gotten away with childish plans (he managed to be a working actor, he manages to fuck a lot of girls, all of these childhood dreams have come true for him).

But being middle-aged doesn't stop these two from acting so childish, and that's one of the points of the movie, I think.  I know it's a somewhat obvious thing for me to point out, but that's my explanation for why he drinks somewhat irresponsibly and gets to make that his lifestyle, basically.  The adult world is a whole lotta pretense.  Icky, icky pretense.  But they're learning, and that's what the movie's about.

This movie ends the same way Monster's Ball ends. You think all is well when the credits start rolling, but later realize that the characters aren't in much better shape than they were when the movie started. I'll write more and explain further in the article I am writing for the green room on Sideways soon.

I would never say that all was or would have been well.  I said it ends with a hint of optimism.  Miles has still got work ahead of him, but he's finally giving something a shot, and that's a happy ending as far as I'm concerned.  As far as Jack goes, no I suppose things aren't much better for him than they were when the movie started.  But Miles is the main character, whose "arc" we're following.  And not everybody in life has an arc at the same time or because of the same event, and so it's more realistic (and kinda funnier) that Jack doesn't really learn anything.  He got his nose broken for fucking around and then fucked another girl That Same Night, and then bashed his friend's car in to explain the nose.  But Miles is a total loser who just keeps going downhill, but finally takes that first step towards something greater.  And it's not about what happens after he knocks on that door, what matters is that he got up there and knocked that door, and that's what puts the smile on people's faces.

Part of that smile is that it's not a dumbed-down ending.  The audience doesn't feel like they're being insulted with an unrealistically happy ending.  And there's no sense that the door is gonna open and they're gonna hug and get married and have babies and Miles is gonna be a successful author all of a sudden or anything like that, and if any of that had happened, it would have been quite the crap ending.  Most of Sideways's audience has appreciated the ending a lot, though, for having just the right touch of hope that maybe, tonight, Miles won't be sitting alone, drinking his problems and pain away.

[Sleepless]

Okay, let me try to explain a little better why I liked that scene in the diner. I didn't see it as Miles hitting rock bottom, or that he had run out on the weddding reception to do so...

I interperated that as dispite the fact he'd just learnt his ex-wife was now pregnant with her new husband's child, Miles didn't freak out as he would have earlier in the film, he fought with his emotions in that scene and controlled them. I think he realised that the only way he could make his life better was to take responsibility for himself and his actions and attitudes towards life. It was the culmination of everything he had been through and learnt during the course of the whole movie.

I found that scene in the diner to be really uplifting - not at all suicidal - it was Miles' way of starting to get his life back on track. Driking the wine there was a way of showing that he doesn't have to keep his happiness bottled up on a shelf until something great happens. I paraphrase the film: "Openning a bottle of '61 *is* the cause for a celebration." It's a good thing. He's drinking a brilliant wine in an everyday place: so, everyday can be brilliant. Everyday can be the cause for celebration.

That's what I think anyway. And although I felt that's where the movie should have ended, I realise that the answer phone message was quite touching, but that ending seemed to go against the film's idea that in order for Miles' life to start to improve he has to improve his attitudes. Although in a sense I guess that by Miles later driving back up to her house it was the same kinda thing, albeit in baby steps.

Does that make sense? I think that our interpretations of the film are quite similar, just I feel that that for the message of the film to be stronger it should have finished a few scenes earlier. Although you have an equally good point, that the message may have been lost of some people had it not been for those few extra scenes.

In any case, that short simple scene is obviously the eye of the duck scene for the film. It's just so perfect.

[Raikus]

Just to chime in. I completely get what you're saying Sleepless. I got the same interpretation from the '61 with onion rings as you. But I still think the movie is better with the full ending. Basically, you saw Miles kick his rut in the restaurant. He finally understood that he needs to live for himself. He really had no one else (wife having a child, Jack getting married, and the realization that Mya wasn't going to happen), so he decides to start living for him and not how everyone else wants him to live. Plus, he sees how the carefree life can grant happiness (he realizes that while Jack tells his fiance about the accident at the end).

But then, instead of leaving it as self-awareness and identity as its own reward, he gets a bigger payoff. He's still got the first gift, but now he's got the girl back and even more--the knowledge that he's not a failure. That someone out there got what he was trying to do.

Perfect trifecta.

[Sleepless]

Yeah, he's decided to start living rather than just 'be'.

I like what you were saying that Maya gets what he was trying to do, but it seemed to me that when she phoned up out of the blue, then everything seemed to be getting a little to easy for him.

But you're right, the scene in the diner is about Miles starting to realise, but when Maya gets in touch is because she finally understands him. Even though Miles tried to explain himself before with the pinot story, it took Maya reading his novel before she understood him.

That makes more sense now, the diner is the scene where Miles achieves peace within himself, and his reconnection with Maya is where the world finds peace with him. Which is all great, I just feel that the "self-awareness and indentity" is the bigger reward, purely because that is something he has actively taken a step towards achieving.

I think, ultimately, my biggest problem is that scene where he's bored in the classroom. It's as if he's back to his old ways, and I'm thinking "you just achieved so much in the diner! How could you let this happen to you again?!" It's because of that scene that we need the Maya ending. Don't get me wrong, the Maya ending is good, but without the classroom scene the Maya ending wouldn't really have fit in. And my problem with that is that there seems to be no real reason for the classroom scene, other than so the Maya ending fits.

[Sleepless]

I don't mean to keep writing so much about this, when I just want to emphasise that the diner scene is great, and stikes me a far more powerful ending than the Maya ending.

They're both endings, just to different strands.

[bluejaytwist]

you are correct sir
the wine 'ending' is nice, but had the film stopped there, i think it would have been considered by the masses to be a complete downer ending (even though i agree it is not as such.)

if we are talking about 'tacking on an ending,' I'd nominate Mr Back Zraff on Sarden Gtate -- he should have got on the plane and buggered off home, but getting off and running back felt like a HUGE afterthought, or perhaps the suits had their greasy fingers in the pot on that (well give you your little art piece with your wallpaper shirts but you give us a cheesy monologue and a hug with a long dolly out shot pleaseandthankyoupleasuredoingbusiness)

either way. miles is giving it another chance. braff is nailing portman.

roll the credits please

[Myxo]

if we are talking about 'tacking on an ending,' I'd nominate Mr Back Zraff on Sarden Gtate -- he should have got on the plane and buggered off home, but getting off and running back felt like a HUGE afterthought,

Agreed. Him running back to her felt really forced and average.

As far as Sideways goes, I don't think there is anything wrong with the ending. Just that, it doesn't really tell us what happened after he and Maya hook up. It's interesting to me that some movies paint the picture of addiction with a rosy ending. Sideways would make us believe that he and Maya lived happily ever after, but I think the greatness of the movie is really that he's got a long road ahead of him.

[modage]

perhaps the suits had their greasy fingers in the pot on that (well give you your little art piece with your wallpaper shirts but you give us a cheesy monologue and a hug with a long dolly out shot pleaseandthankyoupleasuredoingbusiness)

they didnt.  at the screening i was at braff basically just said he likes happy endings.

[bluejaytwist]

they didnt.  at the screening i was at braff basically just said he likes happy endings.

well then that is fine, and i accept that as the gospel.

my new opinion, based on this revelation, is that the last 30 pages of the script were flawed