Game of Thrones (spoilers)

Started by diggler, June 06, 2011, 02:39:04 PM

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Jeremy Blackman

GoT press malpractice continues. I'm listening to The Ringer's podcast (Binge Mode: Game of Thrones). It's considered one of the most expert-driven podcasts, and they usually offer some pretty good analysis (though I skipped E6). Anyway, they were complaining about Ghost not appearing:

"Did we literally not see him this season?"
"We did not see Ghost this season."
"This is fucking crazy... it's pathetic..."
"To have an entire season of Game of Thrones without a dire wolf appearance, is..."
"It's shameful, honestly."
"It's honestly shameful."
"It's malpractice. Oh man. That fuckin' pisses me off."
"Yeah! It's crazy!"
"I'm getting heated! God damnit..."

Woops, they forgot that we saw Nymeria and her pack. They were a centerpiece of Episode 2.

I would have liked to see Ghost as well, but apparently after the Nymeria scene, for budget/time reasons they had to choose between the zombie polar bear and Ghost. I think they made an okay decision. Did we really want to see Ghost imperiled along with the Magnificent Seven? Did we want to see him curled up at the foot of the bed, barking in approval while Jon and Dany went at it?

Also in this podcast they suggested it would have been nice for the show to explain the type of magic that Undead Viserion was spewing. Umm... really? Are you sure you want that? Do you want one of the guards on the wall to pause and say: "Oh, look! It's not fire, but it's not ice — it must be some new kind of dark energy! And look, it's taking down the wall! Run!"

It's supremely disappointing that when GoT trusts the audience, fans will snipe back at the show all the more.

Jeremy Blackman

And yet, later in that same podcast, they gave me chills describing why the Littlefinger/Sansa/Arya scenes were so great. There's so much character-driven loaded meaning at every turn.

Here's something that didn't occur to me, which they pointed out. Sansa passed the sentence, but Arya carried it out — despite Ned saying that he who passes the sentence must swing the sword. But rather than this being a transgression, it emphasizes that Sansa and Arya are becoming a unit. Sansa is the mind, and Arya is the blade. That could have really exciting implications next season.


See the Final Beautiful Death From Season 7

"The Dragon and the Wolf" was a super-sized episode and it packed an emotional punch for those rooting for the Stark children, as well as fans of master-manipulator Petyr "Littlefinger" Baelish. Artist Robert Ball shares how he approached making the final Beautiful Death piece for Season 7.

Ball refers to the Season 7 finale as, "One of the classic Game of Thrones episodes. It took me a while to come back down to earth afterwards. And that surprise death! Petyr Baelish was one of my favorite characters, and if I were a betting man, my money would have been on him sitting on the Iron Throne at the saga's end — which is why I never gamble, and why I was doubly upset when his schemes finally caught up with him."

"When I saw Littlefinger fall to the Great Hall floor, my immediate idea was to use the floor's flagstones to make a web with Baelish finally caught in the lies that have spun out of control," Ball says. "Then I decided, as it's the last poster of the season, to cram in as much symbolism as the image could take."

Referencing the final drawing, Ball explains, "I've drawn Petyr a mockingbird, his sigil, with his throat cut by the Catspaw blade. The shadow of his wings form three wolves: the Stark children. [The wolf representing] Bran has white eyes, to show his power to warg. Above the mockingbird, the floor forms his web of lies, and below there is a crescent moon — a grisly version of the House Arryn sigil."

"Baelish is multi-coloured to represent his ability to insinuate his way into any house," continues Ball. "The blood from his throat forms a ladder: a nod to his famous quote, 'Chaos is a ladder,' which Bran repeated back to him [in Episode 4]. Sansa's note, which ultimately helped the Stark children trap him, is in his claws, and finally, there is blood on his heart. I believe he genuinely loved Catelyn Stark, maybe even Sansa, and this is a nod to that poisonous love."

Ball's final thought about the season ending? "Bring on Season 8!"

Jeremy Blackman

Tyrion's boatsex reaction solved:

Title of this episode is "The Dragon and the Wolf." Much like "The Children," this refers to multiple things. In this case, they're obviously drawing a comparison between Rhaegar/Lyanna and Daenerys/Jon.

As a student of history, Tyrion knows that Rhaegar & Lyanna falling in love was an epic disaster for themselves and the realm. It was a selfish and reckless act that had an incalculable cost, and they were torn apart anyway.

This is what I said before:

Quote from: Jeremy Blackman on August 31, 2017, 12:14:37 AMSpeaking in-universe here, it's funny that Tyrion would be on a high-horse about judgment being clouded. As if he's some kind of standard of good decision-making.

From my POV, he should be sort of happy that the Targaryen-Stark alliance looks significantly more solid now.

He does have reason to worry, though. Dany and Jon will probably end up making strategic decisions based on a desire to protect each other or even simply to be together. Just as Dany wanted to travel with Jon despite the risks.

But objectively speaking, the risks far outweigh any benefit there is to be gained from "strengthening the alliance." Emotionally I want to believe it, but that's not a rational viewpoint. Tyrion is trying to be a rational thinker, because after his many failures that's probably all he has left.

And yet, he might be proven wrong once again. I would like to see a Dany/Jon union actually strengthen the realm, yet another iteration of breaking the cycle and correcting the mistakes of their ancestors. Is that wishful thinking?


New theory: Jaime is known as the King-Slayer because he killed the mad king. But what if it's also prophetic? What if he kills the Night King? Specifically, Bran - who Jaime paralyzed by pushing him through the window in the show's very first episode - wargs into Jaime to deliver the fatal blow.

Even crazier theory: Bran has to warg into Jaime to kill the Night King because it's certain death and even Jamie isn't that crazy. So Jaime kills the Night King but is summarily killed himself and becomes a solider of the army of the death. He then marches with them to Westeros, where he fulfills that other theory about him being the one who kills Cersei.
He held on. The dolphin and all the rest of its pod turned and swam out to sea, and still he held on. This is it, he thought. Then he remembered that they were air-breathers too. It was going to be all right.

Jeremy Blackman

I think the wargee has to be of less than full human intellect, like an animal or Hodor. It's possible that Jaime gets hurt enough in battle that he's wargable. But narratively, I feel like it's inevitable that Jon delivers the fatal blow to the Night King. If they upend that expectation, it'll have to be sufficiently interesting.

Whatever the case, Jaime is one of the characters I'm most curious about right now, since he does seem to be joining the coalition. Obviously there's going to be some initial conflict and worry that he's an infiltrator, but then Tyrion and Brienne vouch for Jaime's honor, and Jon calms everyone down because it's humanity vs. the dead. Still, I can't imagine the tension ever really going away.

Side note. The consensus seems to be that either Jon or Dany will survive the series, but not both. I strongly feel like Daenerys will survive. She is clearly going to get pregnant, and I kind of doubt GoT is going to kill two pregnant principal characters in one season. Jon is far more likely to put himself in a martyrdom type of situation. The show has also done a lot of work to establish that he won't be brought back again.


Game of Thrones' Season 8 Directors List Hints at Massive Ice Battles to Come

HBO on Tuesday announced the list of directors for the final season of Game of Thrones, and befitting that season's abbreviated length (it's only six episodes, though each will be longer than a typical GOT installment), the list is only four names long: David Nutter, Miguel Sapochnik, and showrunners David Benioff and D.B. Weiss. Benioff and Weiss will jointly handle the series finale; there's no word on episode counts for Nutter and Sapochnik. Nutter has directed six GOT episodes, including "The Rains of Castamere," while Sapochnik famously helmed both "Hardhome" and "The Battle of the Bastards." Add Sapochnik's presence to the news from Variety that each episode in the final season is expected to cost $15 million, and one thing is clear: There are going to be some major battles coming in Thrones' final season. (Good news for fans of the iconic ice dragon, who will likely get plenty more chances to cause drama.) No premiere date has yet been announced for season eight, which likely means that Jon Snow and his aunt are going to be spending a long time on that boat.


Because of Sapochnik? Wasn't that obvious already?

Nice list, tho.

Jeremy Blackman

Thank God Sapochnik is back. We are in capable hands. D&D are directing episodes, though? Interesting.


Apparently they've each directed one episode previously -- Benioff directed S03E03, Weiss directed S04E01 -- but have no other directorial experience beyond a short film Benioff made in 2006. Seeing no Michelle MacLaren or Neil Marshall on the list is sad, but Nutter and Sapochnik definitely know what they're doing.
My house, my rules, my coffee


Variety Interview.

'Game of Thrones': Sophie Turner Talks Pivotal Scenes, Season 8 Premiere

What was your favorite scene from last season?
It was probably the moment that you realized that Sansa was going to kill Littlefinger [Aidan Gillen] and does kill him, and when you realize that Sansa and Arya Maisie [Maisie Williams] had been scheming behind Litlefinger's back, which is a pretty impressive thing to do for two young girls against a master manipulator. It was just a really powerful moment for her, to have used up all of her master's lessons and finally discard him. The student becomes the master now.

That scene was your last with Aidan Gillen, who you've worked with a lot over the series. What was it like to be working with him for the last time.
It was really hard, because out of all the people I've worked with on the show, he has been the one who was consistent throughout, from season one to season seven. He has been my "Game of Thrones" experience. He's been the backbone of it for me. So to say goodbye to him was pretty hard, especially because life imitated art in a way, because he was also my mentor. I learned so many lessons just by watching him act. It was this weird parallel, and an emotional thing for everyone.

What has it been like for you to work through your formative years as an actor on a show like this with so many very good veteran actors?
My standards have definitely been raised. It's a blessing and a curse, "Game of Thrones" being my first job and working with such incredible scripts and such incredible veteran actors, and working with the best crew. It makes you a bit of a snob, I think. And because it was my first job, the actors on "Game of Thrones" are the people I learned to act from. I learned to act watching Lena [Headey] and Peter [Dinklage] and Maisie and Kit [Harrington] and all of these different people. I put them all on such pedestals. The thought of not working with them is almost excruciating to me. They've been my growing up.

How will Sansa fare next season without Littlefinger in her ear?
It's going to be tricky for her, because at the end of last season, she felt that she had everything set up. She had her family back together. They were in control of the North again. This season, there's a new threat, and all of a sudden she finds herself somewhat back in the deep end. And without Littlefinger, it's a test for her of whether she can get through it. It's a big challenge for her, without this master manipulator having her back. This season is more a passionate fight for her than a political, manipulative kind of fight.

Is that because this season she faces less a political threat and more an existential, zombie sort of threat?
Well, I don't know. We'll have to see.

Where are you at in production on season eight?
We started in October, so we're maybe like a tenth of the way through. [Laughs.] No, no, we've got six or seven months left.

Is there a consciousness on set of the fact that this is the last season?
There definitely is. When we all had the read-through for the final season, it was very, very emotional. For the first time in "Thrones" history, we had everyone there. All of the Americans wanted to come over. Every single cast member was pretty much there. We're all kind of feeling the end of it coming. We're all staying in town a little longer, going out for more meals, trying to get together more. We're all trying not to take it for granted any more.

You've been able to do the "X-Men" movies. Now that you won't have "Thrones" anymore, what else do you want to do?
I kind of want to do everything. I feel this sense that everything  is over "Game of Thrones"-wise. I have nothing to lose right now, because I don't have "Game of Thrones" anymore. I'm kind of born again, because I'm at a different stage of my career now — not necessarily at a higher level, I just find myself at a different version of my career. So I'm going to try my hand at everything.

Are you excited for next year, with "X-Men: Dark Phoenix" and season eight of "Game of Thrones" set to premiere?
Yeah, I'm really excited. "Game of Thrones" comes out in 2019. "Dark Phoenix" is in November. Then I have a couple indie movies coming out. I'm a producer on my next movie ["Girl Who Fell From the Sky"]. So I'm really excited about the future.


My husband watches it! But I think it's boring! Anyway, thanks for sharing your thought, guys!


My house, my rules, my coffee


That was a ride.

Quote from: BreannaWatson on December 10, 2017, 04:23:28 PM
My husband watches it!

Husband? And name is Breanna? Cool, we have a female Xixaxer again!

Quote from: BreannaWatson on December 10, 2017, 04:23:28 PM
But I think it's boring!

K... What polkablues said

Quote from: BreannaWatson on December 10, 2017, 04:23:28 PM
Anyway, thanks for sharing your thought, guys!

The fuck the point of that? You a Russian troll?
He held on. The dolphin and all the rest of its pod turned and swam out to sea, and still he held on. This is it, he thought. Then he remembered that they were air-breathers too. It was going to be all right.


Trying catch up on Season 6 and 7.  :yabbse-grin: