HBO's 'Treme' Renewed For Second Season After Just One Episode
source: AP
NEW YORK — HBO says its new drama "Treme" (truh-MAY') has been picked up for a second season just days after its series premiere.
The show is set in New Orleans in fall 2005, three months after Hurricane Katrina. "Treme" tracks the lives of a diverse group of residents as they rebuild their lives and the neighborhood that lends the show its name. Cast members include Wendell Pierce, Kim Dickens, Melissa Leo and John Goodman.
The series was co-created by David Simon, whose past credits include HBO's acclaimed "The Wire," "Generation Kill" and "The Corner."
HBO announced Tuesday that production will resume in New Orleans this fall.
"Treme" attracted 1.4 million viewers for its debut. It airs at 10 p.m. Sunday.
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maybe i can be on the first carriage of the bandwagon this time.
i loved it. as great as the wire was, it didn't have a fantastic premiere so it took a while to get it's hooks in you. this was a fantastic premiere.
I loved this. John Goodman was great. Steve Zahn was kinda annoying but I'll give him a chance. I can't wait for the next episode.
the opening where bunk/ baptiste catches up to the second line and plays his way to the front with the re-birth boys was GREAT. the sound design was amazing. I loved that scene and it just pumps you up and I can't remember where else I've seen that technique of someone else playing music in the distance, and playing his way up to the full band.
Quote from: pete on April 16, 2010, 09:27:53 PM
the opening where bunk/ baptiste catches up to the second line and plays his way to the front with the re-birth boys was GREAT. the sound design was amazing. I loved that scene and it just pumps you up and I can't remember where else I've seen that technique of someone else playing music in the distance, and playing his way up to the full band.
Yesssss. Shit goosebumped me to hell and back.
Epic premiere. So happy this is now in my life.
I just realized the "shorty" they were referring to in that scene was Trombone Shorty aka Troy Andrews - one of the great young talents out of that city. I've seen the kid three times now and each time a good time. I wrote about him on the board before. I think he'll be in the show later.
steve zahn trying to approach a famous person in a bar was fucking spot on.
http://www.nola.com/treme-hbo/index.ssf/2010/04/hbos_treme_creator_david_simon.html
HBO's 'Treme' creator David Simon explains it all for you
In the first episode of "Treme," to be broadcast tonight on HBO, a character will reach into her purse and produce an apple-flavored Hubig's pie. She will do this in late November 2005. With the rest of her dessert menu no longer available, the character, a local chef, will then serve the local delicacy to a patron of her restaurant.
We offer this bit of information freely, as Exhibit A in what will surely become a long list of cited inaccuracies, anachronisms and equivocations through which New Orleanians reassure themselves that not only is our little drama a fiction, but that those who have perpetrated this fiction are indifferent to facts, chronologies, historical possibilities.
True, the Hubig's bakery in the Marigny did not reopen until February 2006, and true therefore, any such pastry found in a woman's purse should by rights be a pre-Katrina artifact and therefore unsuitable for anyone's dessert.
But what you fact-grounded literalists clearly fail to understand is that the pie in Janette DeSautel's purse is a Magic Hubig's. Much in the manner of certain loaves and fishes in the New Testament, or several days worth of sacramental oil in the Old, this Hubig's somehow survives months of post-Katrina tumult and remains tasty and intact for our small, winking moment of light comedy. We know this because we, the writers, imbued the pie with its special powers. We created it. We stuck it in the purse -- or more precisely, the propmaster did. We left it there, waiting for its special moment.
And here's the thing: It won't end with one chunk of pie.
We have trespassed throughout our narrative. And soon enough, the true nature of our many slights and affronts, our intentional frauds and unthinking miscalculations will be subject to the judgment of you whom we have trespassed against.
This is altogether right. Our television drama is taking liberties with a profound, unforgettable period in this city's history. It depicts day-to-day life in New Orleans in the aftermath of Katrina, referencing certain real events, real people and places, real cultural reference points known to many, if not most of those who call this city home.
That we will be held to certain standards by New Orleanians goes with the territory. Beginning tonight, you are the ultimate arbiters -- the only ones we really care about -- on the question of whether our storytelling alchemy has managed to make anything precious or worthy from the baser elements of fact.
Your sensibilities matter to us because we have tried to be honest with that extraordinary time -- not journalistically true, but thematically so. We have depicted certain things that happened, and others that didn't happen, and then still others that didn't happen but truly should have happened.
This is a nice way of saying we have lied.
Why? Why not depict a precise truth, down to the very Hubig's?
Well, Pablo Picasso famously said that art is the lie that shows us the truth. Such might be the case of a celebrated artist claiming more for himself and his work than he ought, or perhaps, this Picasso fella was on to something.
By referencing what is real, or historical, a fictional narrative can speak in a powerful, full-throated way to the problems and issues of our time. And a wholly imagined tale, set amid the intricate and accurate details of a real place and time, can resonate with readers in profound ways. In short, drama is its own argument.
Much of our previous work in this regard was set in Baltimore, where we took pains to incorporate many people, places and events that existed and occurred, and where we made equal efforts to imagine a good deal that never happened.
With "The Wire, " we tried our best to be responsible, of course -- to choose carefully where we would cheat and where we would not.
In a given episode of "The Wire, " if we wrote that the police department, for example, was cooking the stats -- an accusation that goes to the heart of that institution's credibility -- we did so only after being provided with ample evidence that this was, in fact, the case.
On the other hand, if we laid dead homicide detectives out on the green felt of a pool table for drunken wakes in an Irish bar, we did so knowing that such a thing never happened -- although, frankly, upon imagining and filming such ceremonial rites, we came to believe that it damn well ought to be the tradition in Baltimore.
If we are true to ourselves as dramatists, we will cheat and lie and pile one fraud upon the next, given that with every scene, we make fictional characters say and do things that were never said and done. And yet, if we are respectful of the historical reality of post-Katrina New Orleans, there are facts that must be referenced accurately as well. Some things, you just don't make up.
Admittedly, it's delicate. And we are likely to be at our best in those instances in which we are entirely aware of our deceits, just as we are likely to fail when we proceed in ignorance of the facts. Technically speaking, when we cheat and know it, we are "taking creative liberties, " and when we cheat and don't know it, we are "screwing up."
But "Treme" is drama, and therefore artifice. It is not journalism. It is not documentary. It is a fictional representation set in a real time and place, replete with moments of inside humor, local celebrity and galloping, unrestrained meta. At moments, if we do our jobs correctly, it may feel real.
Even then, it is important to understand that the writers, directors, cast and crew are not in any way trying to supplant the historical record, or, for that matter, the personal memories and experiences of real New Orleanians. To the extent actual individuals have inspired or informed a character or a moment, we acknowledge that these characters are nonetheless make-believe. Real folks are entitled to real lives, and to have those lives considered distinct from any and all moments in a television drama.
In Baltimore, most sensible viewers figured all of the above out by episode three, though admittedly, a few politicians and high-ranking police commanders struggled with the concept until the very end. No doubt, it may take at least a few episodes of "Treme" for all of us to figure each other out, and in the event the drama lasts no more than a season, any confusion will scarcely matter.
But going forward, unless otherwise instructed, our suggested rule for watching "Treme," should you choose to watch, is to assume in every instance that someone, somewhere sat in a room and made all of this mess up.
Except for the band that is seen playing good, live music in a Bourbon Street strip joint in episode two. That is, of course, a Magical Strip Joint, of no fixed address.
-David Simon, New Orleans, April 2010
"Cosmically speaking, the more cocks that get sucked, the better."
What a stellar episode. Simon and Co. have another slow-burning masterpiece on their hands. It's exciting to see the storylines start to merge, and in such organic ways; nothing feels forced or contrived. Like the Wire the show is taking it's time and it's all the better for it. The cast is remarkable, my favorite being Khandi Alexander. These characters are so dimensional and the performances feel so lived in, and it's only been 3 episodes!
Interesting opinion I don't necessarily agree with; a few critics are complaining the show is a little too smug and contentious to the viewer, like it feels the need to constantly remind us that we'll never be cool enough to truly understand what makes the city so special. As the New Yorker's Nancy Franklin puts it: "The series virtually prohibits you from loving it, while asking you to value it." I'd argue it's a little early to make such a claim, but I'm interested to hear what you guys think.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/murder-most-mysterious-the-house-of-horror-in-new-orleans-420853.html
it's not looking good for Lucia Micarelli
Quote from: ddiggler on April 27, 2010, 10:59:00 AM
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/murder-most-mysterious-the-house-of-horror-in-new-orleans-420853.html
it's not looking good for Lucia Micarelli
oh no!
I thought the shot of sonny drinking the wine alone towards the end was so sad. Poor guy. hope he doesn't turn to chopping up the gorgeous fiddle player.
With every passing episode steve zahn gets more and more tolerable.
Only ten eps in season 1 right?
so I work with a family that's been relocated from new orleans after katrina. the grandma's sister is Khandi Alexander's mama on the show. a quick chat with her today turned into a scene-by-scene commentary on everything New Orleans. She got so emotional. Fuck the reviewers that call it snobby. You come see this grandma's face and how everything affects her and tell me that again, you pen-pushing boycunt.
this third episode was the one that got things going. khandi alexander is an unbelievable actress. can you think of any other actor that can manage to switch her emotions like she did in that phone call scene?
what i like about this show is that there's originality in the character's conflicts instead of being universal dramatic situations, and how FAR FAR from cliché the narrative is . and it's done with such love... those music scenes are always a joy, instead of being generic world-music bullshit. can't get the theme song out of my head, either.
it broke my heart to see that this episode was written by david mills. he was a great man, and his writing one of the reasons i decided to start taking english literature seriously.
Quote from: cronopio 2 on April 30, 2010, 02:20:58 PM
can't get the theme song out of my head, either.
seriously!
Loved the premier... hoping to catch up on the rest soon so I've been avoiding this thread for fear of spoilers but I just couldn't resist. It's an interesting mix of actors/characters. Great to see WP back in action.
celebrity cameo overload.
Quote from: pete on May 10, 2010, 09:12:34 PM
celebrity cameo overall.
what does this mean?
I think this last one was the best yet. The characters are in place and the story's coming together nicely. Much like in the wire, just when you think things are going well someone gets (SPOIL?) capped.
I meant cameo overload.
Really really love this show, probably my favorite show on TV right now. Although I haven't yet gotten a chance to watch the finale yet.
The music, obviously is awesome... I'm gonna put me together a playlist of some of the featured tracks. Anyone else downloaded some of these yet? Any recommendations?
Don't think the finale's aired yet. These episodes keep getting better but....some of these musicians that pop up randomly are HORRIBLE actors.
My bad. For some reason since there was no episode Memorial weekend I thought the week before's was the final episode. So glad I was wrong.
So is this show worth watching or is it just hype based on The Wire?
Be honest.
The wire wasn't a one hit wonder. Everything these freaks make has been worth watching, most recently Generation Kill. So you shouldn't hav any trouble believing this is worth watching beyond hype value. Although really this is just more hype :/
Well so far I'd say I'm not as completely in to it as I was with the first season of the wire. But the possibilities of where it could go are definitely intriguing. Like i said before though some of the acting is awful and steve zahn's story gets pretty silly at times. But there is a lot going on thats really interesting and I can imagine if it ran for three or more seasons we might start to see some of this oil spill mess. new orleans is just getting constantly shit on, it starts to make baltimore not look so bad.
So what you're saying is I should hold off until season five then devour it all?
I dunno who writes these shows, but it's pretty different from the wire. there much less suspense and the plot is much less complicated. it hooks the audience with amazing music and characters, and you care about them and wanna find out what happens to their lives and how they are going to re-build after losing so much. it's structured like a comedy that way though it does not aim to make you laugh.
The Wire was funny, though, Marlo tending to his pigeons was pretty funny.
I didn't say the wire wasn't funny.
Stefen start watching immediately, it's fantastic (and very funny).
this damn thing took forever to steal but finally catched up til episode 8, so glad to be in the bandwagon although it took me longer than I thought.
I have a huge crush on Annie, and I want to punch in the face that dutch douche piano player, I hope she gets rid of him.
Quote from: P on June 07, 2010, 01:47:28 AM
The wire wasn't a one hit wonder. Everything these freaks make has been worth watching, most recently Generation Kill. So you shouldn't hav any trouble believing this is worth watching beyond hype value. Although really this is just more hype :/
Is it slower than Mad Men?
never thought mad men was slow. the pacing seems pretty typical.
it has a lot of spectacles though - usually quite a few musical set pieces in each episode.
i love this show like i love eating an entire pizza on sundays.
So Treme, yeah. it's coming to DVD next month.
(although I already watched it all illegally online)
Although I would not have watched this show if The Wire hadn't preceded it, I do confess that the only reason I watched The Wire was on a friend's recommendation, and DO NOT regret the journey. I don't say that much about TV, even as a person who was with LOST 'til the end.
To review Treme, I would liken it's tone to Wire fans to the tone of Season 4. The Education Season. That season did not start out with a bang, and we were in familiar yet vulnerable territory. By the end of it, though, many looked back and FELT the season, some even seeing it as a homerun for the series.
Treme is not as slow as Mad Men, yet the build in making you like these characters for who they are takes a few episodes. I would say my favorite character is Big Chief Albert Lambreaoux, and not because he's played by the same guy (Clarke Peters) who played Lester Freamon, but because he is unwavering in the pride he has for his culture. THAT is what this show is about. The strength of one's true spirit versus the uncontrollable powers of nature.
It is the one show where Yes, there is LOTS of music, but you have to respect it as a display of the various cultural elements of the region. The Mardi Gras episode simply seems to float, but after you are done with it you realize it is all part of this experience. "Plenty of moments, but not a life" a character says at one point. Then you flash thru these characters and what they have gone thru in their home, something brought to your heart within Katrina's reign in the fleeting moments of the season, and you realize that EVERY motivation, movement and action on their halves MEANT something important to them in the midst of great loss.
Anyways, give it a try, and if after 3 episodes you aren't interested, just drop it. I personally look forward to seeing what Season 2 is going to be about.
Quote from: socketlevel on May 06, 2011, 02:58:25 PM
Quote from: Fernando on February 11, 2011, 01:38:31 PM
Season 2 premier was this past wednesday, it was a solid 1st episode.
finally something worth to watch this 2011.
Treme?
Quote from: pete on May 06, 2011, 03:26:50 PM
note the date of the posting
Quote from: socketlevel on May 08, 2011, 03:40:29 PM
well shit.
haha dont feel bad.
good news because I didnt know treme had started its 2nd season, and I was bummed that justified ended..
I've seen the 1st ep only, and as usual was really good, man these guys are the best writers ever.
everyone is behind
jesus last episode had some horrific stuff
i like the subtlety these dudes have in expanding the themes and characters. feels like what happened with the docks in the wire.
and david morse is an impeccable actor. i wish my dad spoke like that.
Quote from: cronopio 2 on May 12, 2011, 01:18:59 PMand david morse is an impeccable actor. i wish my dad spoke like that.
I haven't seen this show, but I love David Morse. His best roles are the ones where he's threatening in that bone-chilling way, like his role as the villain in House Season 3, or Dancer in the Dark.
Well, Season 2 Episode 2 landed last Sunday, and we find out why Khandi Alexander dropped News Radio all those years ago. Talk about your acting chops.
spoils for S02E09
last episode felt very wire-ish.
* the obvious demise of Harley. when I saw where he and Annie were walking I smelled trouble, but thought that Annie was going to be the victim.
* batiste channeling bunk saying ''that's new orleans too'' while police cars passes them by.
* lieutenant terry colson being transfer to homicide under the orders of the very same captain he just pissed off.
only two eps to go.
nelson is a douche but he hasn't done anything yet. I wonder what his story is gonna be like.
^^ he's cocky, but at least he wanted to save the city 1/4 mill (while earning $$$ sure), and of course someone told him he should keep the same prices as the rest if he wanted in. but yeah, his real story is about to begin.
I was about to edit my post because wanted to ask you if you knew if hbo had already greenlit season 3, but instead of being lazy I just googled it and IT IS. treme will have one more season.
im glad because these characters have a lot of story to tell, at least two more seasons.
edit: five seasons, that sounds about right.
I hate myself every time I check out this thread since I don't have cabel right now, but I just can't resist it.
Pete, David Simon was at AFF in October and he said the plan was to go 5 seasons so it takes them right up to the Saints winning the Superbowl. Whether we'll get 5 seasons, of course, is another matter.
hey. I knew that.
I thought he was thinking about ending with the gulf oil disaster.
you know, there's a lot of love about the show.
but the smugness is beginning to wear on me - the celebrity drop-ins (especially with Anthony Bourdain's buddies who can't act), the deliberate "anti-storytelling", the attempts at broader comedy (Steve Zahn's hitting some real hammy notes, as he consistently becomes disappointed, and his hip hop loving aunt is quite a cliche), and the self-satisfaction that comes from the show trying to "re-invent" music (steve zahn's character's hip hop anthem, the indian chief doing a jazz album) and having other characters "love" that sound...it's definitely a snooty show and its vying for authenticity is becoming too much.
like, there's almost an Entourage/ Sex and the City vibe in there, in how badly the producers wanna show you a Cool Way to Live, and so much of the episodes were just filled with characters having a better time than the viewers.
I started sniffing something in The Wire season 5, but was relieved when the Iraq miniseries went for really big dramatic scenes, and this was a total scale back. I'll keep watching because the actors are great and the music is good, but the writing, anyway you cut it, is very thin.
I'm just about to finish season one and I get what you say, Pete. I was thinking about that just yesterday as I was watching the mardi grass episode, feeling this show is too "gentle" if that's the word. Everybody is cool, you know? It's interesting for a while but I'm starting to feel impatient.
I'm gonna put a little seasoning on this thread regarding a few things said previously in this thread as I try and work out something lengthy to say about this show.
I finished the first two seasons and let me start with this mention of coolness.
Chief Lambrough is so cool that he is fundamentally stuck in his elitism about a facet of culture that may not exist anymore and is being threatened and dominated (and potentially eradicated) by people who were never a part of that culture and have no business actively dealing with it. He's so cool, it's shaking his entire world essence and existence as he feels pulses of coming to terms with that idea. So, he does everything he can, to keep it alive, despite everything.
Antoine Batiste is so cool he has three broken homes. As if hearing, "hey dad," and watching Batiste turn around to reveal a child, nearly 15 - 17 in age, that the show has never even mentioned or showed isn't enough to tell us how cool that bone player is. That's got nothing to do with Katrina or Cool. That has everything to with the double edged sword that comes with "livin' it," in a lot of cases. I mean Screamin' Jay Hawkins has some illegitmate 90 children all across the globe. That's fucking true. It has a lot to do with being honest and true because Batiste doesn't even fucking bring up his failure as a father until late into the 2nd season. I mean, it's all right there, for as "cool" as it is, it's just as authentic in negative aspects that really play a bigger role in the shaping of things than their coolness. Batiste is so cool he can't even keep a band together.
So this show acknowledges that some locals will harp on Bourbon St. and other commercialized aspects of their culture but meanwhile, it comes back to certain men who've been around telling us all that, "there is pride on Bourbon St." The romanticism is blocked by the sheer over use or mis-use maybe.
Spoils
I don't mean to get personal about the whole cool thing, but bottom line is that this is about a COOL, or IMPORTANT culture. Why would you judge something as 'important?' Because that thing must be performing some function that is unique in some way. This pride that this culture has, can seem elitist, it can seem too cool for school, but these are facets found within everything. The importance is showing the duality in the nature of things and while showing this unique sense of pride that comes from a genuine place, you still show these individuals as being human beings.
These include but are not limited to the direct use of partying inside a building and down the street from that building people are getting shot and raped. Or, it even happens inside the buildings where the good times often occur.
I shall return. And hopefully then I will not be as stoned as i Am now
either you wrote something that's unreadable or I'm too dense. I'm kinda sorta seeing what you're saying.
I'd consulted a bunch of new orleans people - especially this one michelin star chef owner who grew up there. he thought the whole food thing was bullshit, and it was written by a new yorker wanting to show off street cred, and kept bringing in new york chefs to cameo. he thought the rest of the show was bullshit too. the writers just don't know new orleans like they know baltimore, so some of that desire to show how insider they are can come off as desperation. I really liked a few of the big dramatic scenes at the end of season two though.
yeah I don't think I'll ever watch this show.
you really are the bizarro silias. that dude loves everything he's seen; while you hate on everything you'll never see.
What specifically was unreadable?
You actually sound like someone in the show, "Those cats come down from new york and..."
But, I guess for every chef or whoever that thinks it's bullshit, there's
Quote from: pete on April 29, 2010, 09:02:21 PM
so I work with a family that's been relocated from new orleans after katrina. the grandma's sister is Khandi Alexander's mama on the show. a quick chat with her today turned into a scene-by-scene commentary on everything New Orleans. She got so emotional. Fuck the reviewers that call it snobby. You come see this grandma's face and how everything affects her and tell me that again, you pen-pushing boycunt.
which is fine by me. i guess the show didn't necessarily do that to her, but i know people who do find the shows portrayal important and somewhat accurate.
Hope i didn't ruin it for you P, there's a lot to love about the show despite the smugness people complain about and despite my unintelligible rants.
(the funny thing is, i've been sitting in front of this screen scared to post this for about 30 minutes, because personal blows from people I don't know impact me more than they probably should. I must be some form of pathetic)
I was attempting to mock the whole, "this show is smug" attitude that people seem to have, which I would compare to the useless debate that has kept the show, "Girls" relevant (on this board and countless others). Sure it's fun to talk about, but there's really no substance or worth to the argument, especially here regarding treme. As far as 'Girls' goes, I guess that show ISN'T about the girls who are being underrepresented or whatever, which could be said about Treme in some aspects.
My point of the original post was to showcase that the duality of the characters is way too prevalent for them to be that fucking cool, or at least so cool that it's annoying or smug etc. Many of them wear their flaws on their sleeves and much like the wire they do this in the way a greek tragedian might, where that character flaws push the narrative a lot further than how cool they are.
My main objective was to point out that if you feel as though this show tells you, "you'll never understand New Orleans culture," then I'm not sure what you were watching and why you have that defensive reaction to it. Maybe because it's the truth. We won't understand, fully. some people have a problem with that, but that really has no bearing on the show. Furthermore, if watching the show to learn all you can about the culture, you've taken the wrong approach from the go. It's safe to say, I don't understand what those people went through and what effect that atrocious storm had their culture.
This is a 100% unique moment in an American history, and i will forever tip my hat to the people who tried their best to paint us a massive portrait of some of the struggles Katrina victims have gone through and how they use their love of the arts to try their hardest to get by.
The reality is people need to know about the disasters of Katrina and on this personal level, and this is one way to go about it. Getting down in New Orleans and showing the aftermath, shooting on location after of one of the most devastating events in our history is unique.
At a bare minimum this show made me realize that my fellow man needed my help when the storm happened, and I am thankful for that, because you can guarantee next time and act of humanity is needed I'll be there. And this all stemmed from a fucking television show.
Next, Where do they seem desperate to look like an insider? Such a powerful statement with such ambiguity. It doesn't say one specific real thing about the show itself, but it merely backs up the idea you tried to present earlier in that post which was that, someone wants to show off. I hardly believe that to be the case.
Also, i mean the show takes place in New York, So it may seem right that Anthony Bourdain or a New Yorker writes stuff for an ep regarding kitchen scenarios. And if you watch that video in my last post, you'll see a other chefs from New Orleans disagree. Maybe i haven't "consulted enough people."
This whole board is pretty much cred oriented. I have zero, so every time i try to say something (that I typed on the fly) I just catch hell for it. And it's more personal attacks and less, "your argument sucks because of, "X, Y, and Z."
it's not anyone's duty here to teach me how to write properly for xixax, but I guess it is the duty of some to make it clear how big of an idiot I am or how useless my posts are. I just don't get it. That's the type of shit I consider Trolling. but for some reason a post criticizing my posts (which are attempts to get at something artistically) are perfectly fine and relevant. I don't know why i take it so personal, and I don't know why it matters but here i am.
The good news is, they're workin' hard From: http://davidsimon.com/
End of Treme 3 filming
23 May
May 23, 2012
Back home in Baltimore after a long, involved shoot.
How long, you ask? How involved?
Well, if you must know, the following figures were compiled by fellow producer Joe Incaprera. They were delivered to the crew after the last shot of season three, outside a warehouse in Algiers amid champagne and cake.
Number of episodes filmed: 10
Number of shooting days: 113 for first unit, plus 10 days of second unit or splinter unit shooting.
Number of feet of film shot (excluding the last day of filming, which had not been compiled: 1,165,570
Number of feet of film shot for Mardi Gras episode: 165,810
Number of total company moves during filming: 280
Number of locations: 370
Number of no-parking signs posts due to location shooting: 7,000
Number of New Orleans restaurants featured: 27
Number of restaurants built as sets: 2
Number of New Orleans bars featured: 40
Number of New Orleans bars built: 1
Number of speaking parts, seasons three: 347
Number of recurring characters, season three: 95
Number of extras: 9,421
Number of New Orleans musicians filmed: 371
Number of travel memos issued by production office: 383
Number of script revisions: 66
Number of total script pages: 597
Number of times a character says "brah" in dialogue: 21
Number of songs performed live: 106
Number of petty cash and credit card receipts: 12,149
Number of marriages within cast and crew: 2
Number of babies born to cast and crew during production: 2
I've now gone through this cycle 11 times for HBO. At the beginning, each season seems implausible. In the middle, it just is. At the end, one is simply numb. Even if everything works well, there is a sense of having negotiated a minefield for a half year's walk. And it all feels a little absurd for someone who used to tell stories in prose, engaging with himself, an editor and maybe a copyeditor. In the military, they like to note that 60 percent of strategy is logistics. Same with filmmaking, I suppose. All credit to Nina Noble and one of the best cast and crews with whom I've worked.
Guys, if you didn't get to the Bridge on Thursday and put a hurt on my credit card, I still owe you a couple. Track me down in the fall, I hope.
Quote from: Neil on June 10, 2012, 05:06:09 PM
This whole board is pretty much cred oriented. I have zero, so every time i try to say something (that I typed on the fly) I just catch hell for it. And it's more personal attacks and less, "your argument sucks because of, "X, Y, and Z."
it's not anyone's duty here to teach me how to write properly for xixax, but I guess it is the duty of some to make it clear how big of an idiot I am or how useless my posts are. I just don't get it. That's the type of shit I consider Trolling. but for some reason a post criticizing my posts (which are attempts to get at something artistically) are perfectly fine and relevant. I don't know why i take it so personal, and I don't know why it matters but here i am.
that's funny, because it's like you're being the REVERSE of a Troll (what is that? some kinda orc? not really into fantasy...)
What I mean is you're injecting well thought-out ideas supporting something and not just spouting out " this sux" about stuff.
As for your analysis of Albert and Antoine, that really makes a good point about the show. Some characters are working so hard to retain the culture of a place they have physically lost that they're denying their own unique family ties. They deny what they need for what they want in some cases too, as was definitely a theme of last season (see the archs of Sonny, Antoine, Davis, and more).
I'm not sure if
Treme will ever live up to
The Wire in many people's minds. While
The Wire took the common police procedural and shaded it with extremely specific cultural references and emotional realities, Treme attempts to capture a unique society by creating its own storytelling framework. So they kind of work in opposite directions. And I think
Treme may be too on the nose about certain themes at times (see Nelson Hidalgo, Annie talking to Steve Earle). I just hope people give it a chance because I imagine the show can be as good as
The Wire was if given the proper amount of time to tell its tale.
Sure, that could just be wishful thinking...or maybe the show was never intended to be
McNulty & Friends 2.0.
neil I like how you look at the show.
though the duality does not necessarily make it smug-proof. I love a lot of the drama in there; though I still think it's a smug show. I don't think showing the characters' weaknesses invalidates their cool. and I don't think all them New York chefs studding a show about New Orleans for no reason other than they're Anthony Bourdain's friends undercuts the importance of telling a post-Katrina story.
also, my grandma story was through the first season, before moments in the second season when steve zahn put hip hop and brass together or david chang cameo'd like six times for no reason.
Quote from: pete on June 13, 2012, 03:13:20 AM
and I don't think all them New York chefs studding a show about New Orleans for no reason other than they're Anthony Bourdain's friends undercuts the importance of telling a post-Katrina story.
hahah yeah, Jeanette kinda got the short end of the stick last season
I guess I must've missed the new york chefs you speak about. What seems to make sense to me, is that in the 2nd season Jeanette is in New York. That was more so why I felt it was "ok." Plus, I felt like the show was pretty clear about seperating the culture of New York and N.O. This is done with not only Jeanette's storyline as a chef, but also Delmond's plot shows this as he's gigging throughout new york. But, honestly, i thought they really molded the kitchen narratives more so in the 2nd season. :ponder:
There was also something else you said pete that i'd like to briefly touch on and that is that, "david simon doesn't know N.O like he knows Baltimore. I won't argue with that sentence, but I will say just because Treme gives us the ins and outs of a town doesn't really make them comparable or the same ins and outs for that matter.
The Wire seems to be focused on (but not limited to) how those who are oppressed are living in a very similar cycle to those who have the power. Also it focuses heavily on being able to climb the ladder, vs being good at your job. Obviously, I won't hold The Wire to those two sentences. But i'm not so sure N.O is a character in the same way that Baltimore is a character in The Wire. You know what I mean? In both shows we're given an area and then shown the ropes, but we're shown the ropes very closely in the wire so we can see that the system is set up for radical pedagogy, and anything putting the system at risk is seen as a serious threat, hence the phrase, radical pedagogy.'
I haven't quite figured out how to verbally differentiate the two, but I find the above reason to be removed from Treme as a character. With the Nelson story line, we see that things are out of the common folks hand and we also see some of the motivations for rebuilding which I would argue is probably the most "wire-like" element of the whole show. But just imagine how much more elaborate Nelson's story would've been in the wire. That's sort of what I'm trying to say. I feel like each setting serves a different point so to blame Simon's lack of knowledge on N.O just because he was able to fundamentally dissect Baltimore might not necessarily be the negative critique you were thinking, because the Telos of Treme seems to be completely different. I wasn't able to explain this very well, but i've only watched the wire once and treme once too, so hopefully i'll be able to expand on that a little more in the near future.
And as far as Steve Zahn goes. I think DJ Davis is a great character, but that's probably just because I'm that annoying, yet not-so-talented musician in a lot of circles. I seriously have so much joy and giddiness when I talk about music, it makes me feel like a blushing boy who just saw the tag on his baby sitters undies while she was bending over to pick up my toys. At least Davis' story line remains somewhat true in that he leaves the band that's better than he is. I was content with that to conclude the ridiculousness of his story arc.
I still follow the show religiously. I want to see where the characters are heading. the stories seem to make enough sense. but still, there's this almost who-gives-a-fuck quality to it, where the disparate strands of the stories never really tie together, and some characters' arcs are really fucking trivial. it's almost using realism as a crutch, substituting the tediousness of opening a restaurant (against the backdrop of katrina and new orleans yada yada) in place of drama. even the music's not as good. and it's also just got the most uninspired editing I've seen in an ensemble show, where we skip from character to character scene by scene with no momentum or coherence. I think even the creators are bored.
First I'd like to ask if anyone knows a place to stream this season that isn't HBOgo. I don't have a cable provider and it appears as though this is the only way to get HBOgo. Have i read this correctly?
Also @ pete, I suppose that tediousness is the inevitable telos for a show that is rooted in, "anti-storytelling," as you call it.
New Orleans is very much a melting pot of cultures and pasts, so it's not surprising that the only thing certain characters have in common is their geography. I feel that this is a heavy aspect in the show. You know, showing that the same struggles are dealt with through different cultural artifacts/foundational aspects of the culture. Sure, this doesn't excuse it from any of your complaints, but it is fun to discuss.
I'm just currently a little more hesitant to put it on the chopping block due to its wildly unconventional way of doing things. There are often mis steps in uncharted territory.
Pete, I'm interested to see how your critiques hold up during my viewing of this 3rd season. I've yet to check any of it out. I hope they're not bored.
I like the characters and the stories enough to keep watching, but sometimes the conclusions they reach at the end of the season make you realize, even by David Simon standards, they're pretty fucking leisurely and can't just be chucked up to "bold storytelling" when twelve or thirteen episode seasons feel at least three episodes too long, and when you see some of the conclusions, you realize you were right about wondering what some of the scenes peppered throughout the season leading up to their end were even there. Simon kinda placed himself above criticism by being very aggressive towards anything related to traditional television, but a hoaky take on fine dining is a hoaky take on fine dining (I think that thread is by far the weakest and the most self-congratulatory), and uninspired editing of an ensemble story that spans over 13 seasons, can't be debated into otherwise either. I understand that he says "this is not The Wire" (which was terrifically edited, connecting stories and characters thematically or plot wise or just by having a very strong, infectious point of view towards their ambitions and struggles) and I understand this is not Nashville, but at the end of the day, you've gotta leave the viewer with something to get still, right?
I'm not sure if Simon & Co. have had this slow-burn going for awhile on purpose now, or that they're just improvising their way through each season.
Notice characters are starting to connect to other characters in ways we haven't expected, such as LaDonna and Albert, or Delmond and the building developer...is that just because the writers have had these meetings planned all along? Did they want us to get to know our characters better and then appreciate their connections?
OR is it that every character arc is planned then paced out in a leisurely way because they can't figure out a way to give the show momentum without a police case fueling it?
If there's one good thing I can say about this season it's that it seems to flow more naturally. There's less awkward introductions to musical legends and at least every character seems to have an agenda. I personally enjoy Delmond dedicating himself to the Indians.
As for "watching it just to see where it goes", yeah, I'm on that page too. It's not like watching "The Office" where you STRUGGLE to care, but still want to see what happens with your characters. I'm still not sure what this show's legacy will be, although the people of NOLA surely seem to appreciate the portrayal.
I'm about 3 episodes away from the series finale :(
There's a lot of cringe worthy bullshit from me throughout this thread, but I mean it when I say, this show has been a truly fantastic experience. There are definitely comparisons between Treme and The Wire. But, with Treme I don't believe the aims are the same. I believe they use similar techniques and themes, however Treme as a show is much more 'slice of life,' or something. I don't think it's "bold storytelling," I'm just not sure it's interested in the arcs that are commonly found, because there's so much that exists off the page in the case of TREME. To me, the "smugness" of this show comes from the pride that this area has, which I believe is earned. Honesty is not arrogance, it's awareness. This show has A LOT of awareness.
most will likely argue against this, but I enjoy the fact that things have picked up so much. I feel like the stakes are high for everyone at this point, and i'm excited to see it through to the end.
@Antidumbfrogquestion
I'm not sure if it was planned or if that even matters at all. What I will say is that the connections don't seem too radical to me. I feel like all the pieces fit together nicely, which is not really what I would've expected, but nothing seems overly forced. Really enjoy this show
Glad to hear it's still good. I've only watched the first season so far but plan on binging the whole thing once I'm done with Friday Night Lights.
Neil is the only one saying it's good.
Everyone else is saying it's the most inconsequential show of all time.
In other words, David Simon is DONE.
Do you look forward to dismissing incredibly talented people as 'done'? Do you have a checklist? You haven't even watched this show, right?
Quote from: Pubrick on March 05, 2014, 05:48:25 PM
In other words, David Simon is DONE.
Great timing, just before news about Martin Luther King miniseries surfaces. HBO showed huge amount of patience, when it comes to dramas. Milch killed three horses and they still want him. In that respect, I don't think Simon is done yet.
Quote from: Mel on March 06, 2014, 11:56:57 AM
Great timing, just before news about Martin Luther King miniseries surfaces
Hope he brings his A-game. I mean it's gonna be difficult to squeeze the entire life of a person as important as that into even a miniseries.
What I'm trying to say is- you come at the King, you best not miss.