Brilliance In Dialogue

Started by SoNowThen, September 11, 2003, 01:15:08 PM

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Banky

#30
September 12, 2003, 09:48:16 AM
Quote from: SoNowThenAwesome :roll: ... it said "brilliance in dialogue", and very clearly stated not "hip" dialogue. Trying to be cool dialogue (which I like most of the time) is a too-cute kinda writing to fit in this category. So Kevin Smith does not belong here. As I said, Tarantino dialogue and the Swingers stuff and Smith, they're a different beast.

We're talking Brilliance here. Like the scene between the two detectives and Fink in Barton Fink.

Damn it....

sorry but i think that is totall bullshit.

Pulp Ficion is considered to be one of the greatest movies of our time.  It was a phenomenon and has been mimicked ever since.  THE WHOLE FUCKING MOVIE IS DIAOGUE.  To me that is more than just "hip."  You dont win oscars for screenplays that just have "dumb characters saying witty things."

SoNowThen

#31
September 12, 2003, 09:54:38 AM
I didn't say "dumb characters saying witty things". Just that it seems that there is a very clear line between Coen dialogue and Tarantino dialogue. I guess what I was driving at is the interplay that Mamet and Coen characters have has this amazing beat to it. I dunno.

Like I think Clerks is way better than State and Main, but I think Mamet is far superior in terms of just writing the most brilliant dialogue...
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

Banky

#32
September 12, 2003, 09:59:45 AM
Quote from: SoNowThenI didn't say "dumb characters saying witty things".
mutinyco said something along those lines



so would you say Pulp Fiction is an example of Brilliant Dialogue?[/quote]

SoNowThen

#33
September 12, 2003, 10:01:55 AM
not in this case for this thread


but of course Pulp's brilliant. I got into making movies because of Tarantino. I love the guy.

Can we think of any along the lines of my original two?
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

Banky

#34
September 12, 2003, 10:20:55 AM
its friday at 1:30, shouldnt we be in class or at work?haha

Ummm............along those lines....................maybe the plane crash scene in Almost Famous?

mutinyco

#35
September 12, 2003, 10:49:13 AM
I'm probably the one person who thinks Pulp is a bloated, boring waste of time. I prefer Tarantino's early trilogy of True Romance, Natural Born Killers, and Reservoir Dogs. I had read all three -- both TR and NBK before they came out -- so when I read Pulp before it came out it didn't seem to me to be anything new. In fact, I thought it lacked the energy of the first three. I just think that most people weren't familiar with him prior to Pulp, so that's what they love and use as their reference.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

ProgWRX

#36
September 12, 2003, 10:49:42 AM
if considering Almost Famous i really have to go with the Phillip Seymour Hoffman scenes at the beginning...

also some of the Frances McDormand stuff on it too..
-Carlos

SoNowThen

#37
September 12, 2003, 10:55:14 AM
Quote from: mutinycoI'm probably the one person who thinks Pulp is a bloated, boring waste of time. I prefer Tarantino's early trilogy of True Romance, Natural Born Killers, and Reservoir Dogs. I had read all three -- both TR and NBK before they came out -- so when I read Pulp before it came out it didn't seem to me to be anything new. In fact, I thought it lacked the energy of the first three. I just think that most people weren't familiar with him prior to Pulp, so that's what they love and use as their reference.

I wouldn't call it a waste of time, but I certainly have always liked Dogs and Jackie Brown better.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

NEON MERCURY

#38
September 12, 2003, 11:34:55 AM
i guess i am taking brilliant to literal....i just answer the question of my opinion of brilliant dialogue..k smiths writings suffice's this ..and i am not a fan boy of him its just that he's a brilliant comedic writer ...

compare chasing amy, clerks, dogma..which is brilliant comedic writing ..
to old school , loser , saving silverman, american pie 2, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, ...........do you see the diference??....

SoNowThen

#39
September 12, 2003, 11:38:01 AM
true enough, but you picked the shittest comedies...

how about Swingers, Made, Road Trip, hell Lebowski is a comedy. I find those just as funny as Smith, and they actually look good too!
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

NEON MERCURY

#40
September 12, 2003, 11:42:42 AM
Quote from: SoNowThentrue enough, but you picked the shittest comedies...

how about Swingers, Made, Road Trip, hell Lebowski is a comedy. I find those just as funny as Smith, and they actually look good too!

..true esp.. swingers very under-rated ..but you see what i mean though you mentioned stuf also that i would require brilliant..though there's tons really..

you could say blazing saddles, fast times, naked gun, ..thers lots that i think are brilliant and thats just for the comedies ............good thrread...... :!:

Find Your Magali

#41
September 12, 2003, 12:11:55 PM
Well, if we're talking dialogue-driven comedies, here's a list of personal favorites that represents a wide swath of film history:

-- His Girl Friday
-- Arsenic and Old Lace
-- Some Like It Hot
-- Monty Python and the Holy Grail
-- Broadcast News
-- Office Space

And for dialogue-driven TV comedy brilliance (not that you asked), just head for Fawlty Towers and Sports Night.

modage

#42
September 12, 2003, 12:23:28 PM
Quote from: Find Your Magali-- His Girl Friday
-- Arsenic and Old Lace
-- Some Like It Hot
-- Monty Python and the Holy Grail
-- Broadcast News
-- Office Space

hey! i've seen all of those, great.  anyways, i actually just watched Arsenic and Old Lace last nite and i did not like it.  it was really really dark and weird.  and although i did like Cary Grants comic performance the movie was not my cup of tea.
Christopher Nolan's directive was clear to everyone in the cast and crew: Use CGI only as a last resort.

MacGuffin

#43
September 12, 2003, 12:29:46 PM
Quote from: Find Your Magali-- His Girl Friday

Funny you mention that...From "Pulp Fiction":

1.      INT. COFFEE SHOP - MORNING                                      1.

       A normal Denny's, Spires-like coffee shop in Los Angeles.
       It's about 9:00 in the morning.  While the place isn't jammed,
       there's a healthy number of people drinking coffee, munching
       on bacon and eating eggs.

       Two of these people are a YOUNG MAN and a YOUNG WOMAN.  The
       Young Man has a slight working-class English accent and, like
       his fellow countryman, smokes cigarettes like they're going
       out of style.

       It is impossible to tell where the Young Woman is from or how
       old she is; everything she does contradicts something she did.
       The boy and girl sit in a booth.  Their dialogue is to be said
       in a rapid-pace "HIS GIRL FRIDAY" fashion.


The Coen Bros. also used "His Girl Friday" as the basis for Jennifer Jason Leigh's character in "Hudsucker Proxy".
"Don't think about making art, just get it done. Let everyone else decide if it's good or bad, whether they love it or hate it. While they are deciding, make even more art." - Andy Warhol


Skeleton FilmWorks

Sigur Rós

#44
September 12, 2003, 12:35:20 PM
Quote from: Banky
Chasing Amy

Couldn't possibly agree more with you! Jason Lee delivers some great lines  :-D

But maybe I only agree with you because I wanna fuck your avatar...
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