Kotte asks...

[cron]

Dogville.

It depends how you look at it. Movie or a filmed play.

I see it as a play and you can't really call theater self-consious. It's perform infront of us, the audience. Non-self-conscious movies let a potential audience take a peek inside the lives of the characters.[/i]

I think it's wrong to call Dogville a filmed play.  Not only it's an unfilmable play( because of weather effects and cars , to name some examples) but the subtleness , or the big idea, could only work in a cinematic way. Point in fact,  i can't imagine another director other than Lars Trier pulling 'that' off . His hypnotic editing style comes very handy on this movie.

What i meant when i said  self-consious is that when you start watching it,  you are aware that you are not watching a normal 'anything' .

[kotte]

Dogville.

It depends how you look at it. Movie or a filmed play.

I see it as a play and you can't really call theater self-consious. It's perform infront of us, the audience. Non-self-conscious movies let a potential audience take a peek inside the lives of the characters.[/i]

I think it's wrong to call Dogville a filmed play.  Not only it's an unfilmable play( because of weather effects and cars , to name some examples) but the subtleness , or the big idea, could only work in a cinematic way. Point in fact,  i can't imagine another director other than Lars Trier pulling 'that' off . His hypnotic editing style comes very handy on this movie.

What i meant when i said  self-consious is that when you start watching it,  you are aware that you are not watching a normal 'anything' .

But it is a play. It lacks everything material a film has. Which is what makes it so wonderful and amazing.

[cron]

Dogville.

It depends how you look at it. Movie or a filmed play.

I see it as a play and you can't really call theater self-consious. It's perform infront of us, the audience. Non-self-conscious movies let a potential audience take a peek inside the lives of the characters.[/i]

I think it's wrong to call Dogville a filmed play.  Not only it's an unfilmable play( because of weather effects and cars , to name some examples) but the subtleness , or the big idea, could only work in a cinematic way. Point in fact,  i can't imagine another director other than Lars Trier pulling 'that' off . His hypnotic editing style comes very handy on this movie.

What i meant when i said  self-consious is that when you start watching it,  you are aware that you are not watching a normal 'anything' .

But it is a play. It lacks everything material a film has. Which is what makes it so wonderful and amazing.

Still, the 156 crane shots put together make me think different...

[kotte]

Dogville.

It depends how you look at it. Movie or a filmed play.

I see it as a play and you can't really call theater self-consious. It's perform infront of us, the audience. Non-self-conscious movies let a potential audience take a peek inside the lives of the characters.[/i]

I think it's wrong to call Dogville a filmed play.  Not only it's an unfilmable play( because of weather effects and cars , to name some examples) but the subtleness , or the big idea, could only work in a cinematic way. Point in fact,  i can't imagine another director other than Lars Trier pulling 'that' off . His hypnotic editing style comes very handy on this movie.

What i meant when i said  self-consious is that when you start watching it,  you are aware that you are not watching a normal 'anything' .

But it is a play. It lacks everything material a film has. Which is what makes it so wonderful and amazing.

Still, the 156 crane shots put together make me think different...

So just because he shows things ten feet up it's a film film? Then, theoretically, the audience watching a broadway show from the balcony are watching a movie?

I know Dogville is a film but I still think it is, in a way, a filmed play. The crane shot argument won't make me think differently.

[cron]

then we'll have to disagree.    while we're on the subject,  after watching it (i mean, days after)  did you get the sensation that the bushes,houses, and even the landscapes where really there?    that's one of many aspects i loved of the movie.

[kotte]

then we'll have to disagree.    while we're on the subject,  after watching it (i mean, days after)  did you get the sensation that the bushes,houses, and even the landscapes where really there?    that's one of many aspects i loved of the movie.

Not really. It's too artificial for that. The whole point of the style was to strip out everything but the core: The characters and the story.

Let's movie this dicussion to the Dogville thread.

[Alethia]

a wonderully self conscious movie is annie hall.

it definitely is very broad and vague as P said, i guess you can stretch it so far that almost every movie is self conscious in some way...

[ElPandaRoyal]

the thing with High Fidelity is that a big part of the movie (at least half of it),  you get the feeling that you're watching a book. but not because is self-conscious, it's a bad adaptation, IMO.

Now hold it right there. I've just recently read High Fidelity and I think they did a great adaptation job on that one. It's a very self-reflective narrative, told by one man's point of view and I think they did a fresh, funny and, well, certainly self-conscious movie in... the good... way...  

[cron]

time to ask something new , Kotte

[zerocool41]

would austin powers apply..

i recall a scene where bazzle looks at the screen and says 'you all have a good time too' and austin looks with him...or am i off topic

[Sanjuro]

godard films!!!
especially band of outsiders

[kotte]

What's the name of the guy that died of filmmaking? A german guy.

[mogwai]

klaus kinski?

[kotte]

could it be?

that's the way to go. Filmmake oneself to death.

[mogwai]

it might be him i'm not even sure. but he always went to extreme when it came to acting like in the herzog directed movie "woyzeck". kinski had just wrapped with herzog the shooting of "nosferatu" and went straight on to make "woyzeck". you've probably seen the doc "my best fiend - klaus kinski (directed by herzog) where herzog mentions that kinski burned himself out after making his directorial debut "kinski paganini". that would mark the end of his work in the movie business and he later passed away of a heart attack in 1991 at the age of 65.