Xixax Film Forum

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Nolan's next film - It is based on American Prometheus, a biography of J. Robert Oppenheimer written by Kai Bird and Martin J. Sherwin (https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/80571). I highly recommend this book, it's a breeze to read because Oppenheimer's life was a privileged one that lead to extravagant adventures, from his home marked by his mother's Picasso's, childhood at the Ethical Culture Fieldston School, to an adolescence where he left craters in science circles worldwide. His brother was an active member of the Communist Party. Robert, meanwhile, would attend meetings and help write pamphlets, but always paid his dues in secret.

After the formulation of war technology - the US Carthyite period would come down on Oppenheimer and ostracize him from the country he loves.

Its cast iz immense  (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt15398776/fullcredits)

Professor Kip Thorne, who developed the science of Interstellar and (in a fantastical sense) TENET at a memorial for Oppenheimer, 2019:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgkSz1ljcfg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uY-u1qyRM5w

I'm looking forward to this. I can't imagine it'll be a straightforward high-gloss biopic. It's a fascinating and terrifying (and all-too-timely) story. I suspect its gruesome subject matter and the renewed nuclear threat will harm its commercial prospects, though. 

I know it's become fashionable to trash Nolan – and I certainly wouldn't say that none of the criticism is earned – but as contemporary blockbuster filmmakers go personally I'd much rather have his flawed but intermittently inspired and often quite daring movies than the artistically much more conservative and plodding Villeneuve.

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Instead of simply doing a movie about the guy who invented the clock...

Quote from: Drenk on July 28, 2022, 10:42:15 AMInstead of simply doing a movie about the guy who invented the clock...

That man's name? Dr Clockenstein.

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Christopher Nolan Recreated a Nuclear Weapon Explosion Without CGI, Developed New IMAX Film for 'Oppenheimer': 'A Huge Challenge' (https://variety.com/2022/film/news/christopher-nolan-oppenheimer-atomic-bomb-explosion-no-vfx-1235457979/)

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QuoteChristopher Nolan revealed to Total Film magazine that he recreated the first nuclear weapon detonation without CGI effects as part of the production for his new movie "Oppenehimer." The film stars longtime Nolan collaborator Cillian Murphy as J. Robert Oppenheimer, a leading figure of the Manhattan Project and the creation the atomic bomb during World War II. Nolan has always favored practical effects over VFX (he even blew up a real Boeing 747 for "Tenet"), so it's no surprise he went the practical route when it came time to film a nuclear weapon explosion.

"I think recreating the Trinity test [the first nuclear weapon detonation, in New Mexico] without the use of computer graphics was a huge challenge to take on," Nolan said. "Andrew Jackson — my visual effects supervisor, I got him on board early on — was looking at how we could do a lot of the visual elements of the film practically, from representing quantum dynamics and quantum physics to the Trinity test itself, to recreating, with my team, Los Alamos up on a mesa in New Mexico in extraordinary weather, a lot of which was needed for the film, in terms of the very harsh conditions out there — there were huge practical challenges."

"Forget any preconceived notions you might have about a historical biopic. "It's a story of immense scope and scale," says Nolan. "And one of the most challenging projects I've ever taken on in terms of the scale of it, and in terms of encountering the breadth of Oppenheimer's story. There were big, logistical challenges, big practical challenges. But I had an extraordinary crew, and they really stepped up. It will be a while before we're finished. But certainly as I watch the results come in, and as I'm putting the film together, I'm thrilled with what my team has been able to achieve."

"We're trying to tell the story of somebody's life, and their journey through personal history and larger-scale history," Nolan says. "And so the subjectivity of the story is everything to me. We want to view these events through Oppenheimer's eyes. And that was the challenge for Cillian that I set him, to take us on this journey; that was the challenge for Hoyte van Hoytema, my designer, my whole team: how do we view this extraordinary story through the eyes of the person who was at the heart of it? All of our decisions on how to make this film were based on that real premise.""

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Intrigued to know how one recreates an atomic explosion without recourse to CGI or detonating an actual bomb... lots of clever miniature work?

Judging by the report and the photos, this has real 'feel-bad movie of the summer' energy to it – I'm a fan already.

I also think it's rather admirable of Nolan to use his platform to draw attention to the sheer insanity of nuclear proliferation. People ought to be frightened out of their complacency about this issue (although I suspect most folks will head off to see the Barbie film instead).

Quote from: RudyBlatnoyd on December 12, 2022, 04:21:21 PMI also think it's rather admirable of Nolan to use his platform to draw attention to the sheer insanity of nuclear proliferation. People ought to be frightened out of their complacency about this issue (although I suspect most folks will head off to see the Barbie film instead).

I agree.
It baffles me how the "responsibility of art-world toward indictment of arms race money" angle of TENET goes completely ignored in almost all anaylsis of that movie's "intention." One of Nolan's movies created a tragedy of death within a venue. TENET opens with the assault of an art venue and all of us (its audience) in danger no matter our remove from the theatre of war.

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Just seen the leaked trailer for this and it does honestly look like it could be sensational: a mix of Spielbergian awe (with an undercurrent of dread) and SFX reminiscent of the work of Douglas Trumbull.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bK6ldnjE3Y0

Good trailer, but the Imax one is better – it is much more dread-filled and intense. Hope they upload an official version of that too, at some point.

This gives me hope that it's filled with lots of "men at work" type shit a la TWBB. Hopefully not a lot of dialogue since Nolan just never pulls off words IMO.
Those Doug Trumbull looking effects are pretty gorgeous too. Sure to be a highlight.

Quote from: HACKANUT on December 19, 2022, 10:38:08 AMThis gives me hope that it's filled with lots of "men at work" type shit a la TWBB. Hopefully not a lot of dialogue since Nolan just never pulls off words IMO.
Those Doug Trumbull looking effects are pretty gorgeous too. Sure to be a highlight.

It'll have hella men at work ish for sure, the book goes into major detail to describe the passion for science necessary to arrive at the bomb at such a time crunch, and against the military's pressure to risk other nations. (these scientists believed the bomb would be used on the Germans)

Zero chance this can be pulled off with minimal dialogue. Maybe i'll be proved wrong but going off it's source material, it's going to be more of an espionage flick than peeps expect. And obviously the security hearings are getting a lot of B&W press photos. Can't do courtroom without dialogue dumps.

Releasing something seemingly so dialogue-driven and doom-laden in the middle of summer is an admirable act of counter-programming, regardless of whether the movie lives up to expectations or not. Some clunky lines here, but I wonder if that's partly the way the trailer has been cut to clarify the premise for a general moviegoing public who're probably largely uninformed of this story.

Needs to end with a Marvel esque chyron;
Oppenheimer will
*fade in* not return

Too many biopic vibes and historical fiction cliches in this trailer.

Three hours of men in rooms talking about geo-politics – only this time, in IMAX!

I'll definitely see it, because I find this story fascinating, but I'm hoping this is a conventional trailer cut from a more unconventional movie (if this is true, I'm not sure it was the best marketing move by Universal to make it look more like Oscar bait than it really is).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrMdXEtAse8&t=1s

Featurette on Oppenheimer's cinematography ~

QuoteAcademy Award® nominee Florence Pugh plays psychiatrist Jean Tatlock, Benny Safdie plays theoretical physicist Edward Teller, Michael Angarano plays Robert Serber and Josh Hartnett plays pioneering American nuclear scientist Ernest Lawrence.
 
Oppenheimer also stars Oscar® winner Rami Malek and reunites Nolan with eight-time Oscar® nominated actor, writer and filmmaker Kenneth Branagh.
 
The cast includes Dane DeHaan (Valerian and the City of a Thousand Planets), Dylan Arnold (Halloween franchise), David Krumholtz (The Ballad of Buster Scruggs), Alden Ehrenreich (Solo: A Star Wars Story) and Matthew Modine (The Dark Knight Rises).
 
The film is based on the Pulitzer Prize-winning book American Prometheus: The Triumph and Tragedy of J. Robert Oppenheimer by Kai Bird and the late Martin J. Sherwin. The film is produced by Emma Thomas, Atlas Entertainment's Charles Roven and Christopher Nolan.

Oppenheimer is filmed in a combination of IMAX® 65mm and 65mm large-format film photography including, for the first time ever, sections in IMAX® black and white analogue photography.

Some reminiscing on Planet of the Apes on the 'xax Discord server brought Wilberfan to this advert for an Oppenheimer play in LA:

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And I recalled there was a small bit about that in American Prometheus so here's that slice:

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Early reactions (from actual journalists, not those randos who seem to pop out of the woodwork to rave about things like The Flash before they get properly press-screened) are positive. Saw someone compare it to Oliver Stone's JFK, which is a big 'yes' from me – love that crazy-ass movie.

Not as good as the book, what can ya do ~ Some of the contrivances are meant to be dramatic 'shorthand' but I dont think they were needed. More time could have been spent watching Oppie live with and we'd have understood his flaws better than being 'told' about his reputation. Or hell, even just have two or three more scenes of even younger Oppie, the irony of learning to ride horseback to clear his asthma at the site of Los Alamos.

Jennifer Lame rulez!! I hope she gets a nomination for her work here.

Works best for me in the spirit of expressionism. Sound motifs and crumbling sense of surroundings. Nolan finally letting his filmz have a hint of libido. Just a light sprinkle.

Seems like Nolan sneaks late film visual effects to early scenes with I.I. Rabi.

Saw this yesterday with "Barbie" as a double feature. I felt it was a bit too long but the cast was amazing. The cinematography reminded me a bit of "The Master" so I was almost expecting that weird music by Johnny Greenwood in a couple of scenes. I can easily see that this movie will win a lot of awards next year.

For real tho.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdtLxlttrHg

Saw this in 70mm yesterday. One of the strangest tentpole releases of recent years, if not ever.

It's completely anti-spectacle - three hours of claustrophobic close-ups of men in small rooms talking a mile a minute. Even the Trinity sequence is treated in an abstract way - Nolan showing admirable restraint in resisting the impulse to turn this moral failure into a 'money shot'?

Not sure what I felt overall. It's very Nolan: sometimes very smart, sometimes very stupid. Some of the sound design choices seemed highly questionable to me. The cast, especially the supporting players, are mostly excellent. Casey Affleck really stood out to me, in a tiny one scene part. That guy is talented.

Anyway, I'll probably see it a second time to get my thoughts in order.

Quote from: RudyBlatnoyd on July 30, 2023, 03:39:15 AM...three hours of claustrophobic close-ups of men in small rooms talking a mile a minute.

This sounds like a next-level, Tarantino-filmed-a-stage-play-in-70mm ("Hateful Eight").  For this I'm waiting 2 more weeks to see it in 15-perf 70mm IMAX?   :yabbse-tongue:

It do be a bit like that, to be honest. Nolan has completed the PTA and Tarantino auteur trilogy: films shot on a rarely-used, outsized format that are mainly composed of a series of close-ups.

It has stayed with me since I saw it, which is the mark of something interesting. He seems to be getting conceptually bolder with every film, which is exciting. I wonder what a studio will let him greenlight next, given this movie's success...

Crazy how much money this movie is making. Nolan and James Cameron are simply an unstoppable force.

https://twitter.com/MarkHarrisNYC/status/1698387770253689078?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet (https://twitter.com/MarkHarrisNYC/status/1698387770253689078?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet)

PTA on Op

https://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/filmmakers-oppenheimers-900m-haul-important-moment-hollywood-theaters-103309867

Dear Scrooby

Watching Oppenheimer, I couldn't help but think of PTA doing the whole 'men talking in rooms' thing in large format with The Master in 70mm. A friend kept saying after our first viewing of Oppenheimer that the middle of the film reminded him heavily of the TWBB town/camp being built sequence. I do feel that PTA has played in similar tonal, thematic, visual spaces but with more combustive, subtle, nuanced and feverish results which are very much left open to interpretation for the viewer (hence, their lack of popularity or box office success) Anyways long story short, just wanted to get your thoughts on PTA's next steps in light of what Nolan has achieved here. I know PTA makes EXACTLY the film he wants to make and that he could care less about conventional box office success, let alone following in the footsteps of others, but how does he compete in the way filmmakers do, now that Nolan has kind of raised the bar for R rated, 3 hour pictures? I felt that Licorice Pizza was a sweet picture with incredible technical prowess that left a lot to be desired at script stage (despite the critical acclaim) and overall, it didn't resonate with me on the level of say Phantom Thread which was astounding on every level. It feels like such a long time since TWBB and The Master, how does PTA reassert himself and take back his spot?

PS. One of the joys of watching Winning Time was watching it, seeing the amazing low angle close ups in that show and being reminded of The Master only to find that some episodes were indeed shot by Mihai Malaimare Jr. I love PTA's work as his on DOP but my lord, Mihai and Robert Elswitt really put their foot in those images.

Quote from: max from fearless on September 19, 2023, 01:26:06 PMWatching Oppenheimer, I couldn't help but think of PTA doing the whole 'men talking in rooms' thing in large format with The Master in 70mm.

PS. One of the joys of watching Winning Time was watching it, seeing the amazing low angle close ups in that show and being reminded of The Master only to find that some episodes were indeed shot by Mihai Malaimare Jr. I love PTA's work as his on DOP but my lord, Mihai and Robert Elswitt really put their foot in those images.

Oppie didn't work for me AT ALL.  I'm familiar with the story, and just found it totally uninvolving and desperately, crushingly boring. So much so that I left the 15-perf, 70mm, full-IMAX screening about 90 minutes in. Needless to say, it's box-office prowess is rather baffling to me.

Nice to see there's another fan of WINNING TIME.  It took a lot of heat--both from critics AND Lakers, but it was fun to watch. I had no idea that Mihai was onboard for some of the episodes--thanks for pointing that out.

Didn't you even stay for the 'splosion?

That's what everybody asks me!   :laughing:

No, I did not.  I couldn't imagine whatever it was being impressive enough to make up for what I'd already sat thru--nor did I know how much longer it would take to get there.   "Fuck it.  Streaming the 'splosion will be fine..."

Out of the starting gate—the colloquialism conveys anti-academia here—Scroob shall address the phenomenon of Licorice Pizza. Over the years the creative vision of PTA complexified on a precipitous upward trajectory from TWBB to The Master through to Phantom Thread. Simply put, PTA got smarter. Phantom Thread, as I have argued in print tirelessly for ages now, is a narrative with a structure to rival the Oedipus Rex of Sophocles. (It includes what I call the Triple Tone—the narrative is serious, funny, perverse, all at the same time—arguably the most complex technical feat an author can attempt.) Sophocles is widely considered in the running for the greatest literary author in Western history. Scroob will make the case—if called upon to do so—that Sophocles is the greatest. PTA consciously and successfully taking on the wondrous technicity of Sophocles is an unspeakable achievement. Phantom Thread brought PTA to the top of the magic mountain. What else to do after that, but step down a bit, to breathe easier? One cannot exist in a rarefied atmosphere indefinitely, or one will finally pass out, or burn out. Thomas Mann, winner of the Nobel Prize for Literature, always wrote a minor work (in both scope and size) after writing a major work. Apparently this was PTA's intention with Licorice Pizza : the artist needed a rest, needed to turn down the heat a bit. After the unspeakable achievement of Phantom Thread—which I have been tirelessly arguing is the most sophisticated storytelling to emerge from Hollywood since, well, Phantom Thread—there was nowhere for PTA to go in the short term. As Hitchcock would have put it, PTA required a "battery charge" after Phantom Thread. Now consider Nolan. He leapt straight from the colossal production of Dunkirk into Tenet—not the wisest move in retrospect. Nolan needed a rest, and Nolan knows better now. But PTA already knew better—hence, Licorice Pizza. Licorice Pizza is an unabashedly "minor work"—but PTA meant it to be so—just as Punch-Drunk Love is "minor" in scope compared to the broad character palettes of Boogie Nights and Magnolia—just as every composer of music who ever lived in Europe always composed minor works in between their major works. Beethoven didn't just write colossal works, he has many small-scale works, too. The Shostakovich waltz that opens Eyes Wide Shut is one of the composer's most minor works. The movie Amadeus makes a joke about how one of Mozart's most minor works was the most popular of his compositions after his death. So let us not misunderstand Licorice Pizza. It was meant as a small work, a breathing space, a relaxation. In the background, PTA's energy and Unconscious were slowly gathering power—for the next major work to come.

As I have mentioned elsewhere, "people talking in rooms" is cinema—that's what the Golden Age of Hollywood was all about : people talking in rooms. More significantly, "people talking in rooms" is literature—plays and the novel. It's a failure of understanding to approach "people talking in rooms" as some sort of limitation of storytelling vision. Absolutely not. If that were so, we would have to reject the ancient Greek and Roman plays—since they're "nothing more" these days than actors talking to one another—but since Europe preserved these ancient plays, one assumes that these plays may have something going for them. We would also have to reject Long Day's Journey into Night and Death of a Salesman and A Streetcar Named Desire. What do these three plays have in common? They are first and foremost, and from first to last, based exclusively in interpersonal relationships. Oppenheimer has reminded the widest possible audience what is fundamental to a first-rate narrative : interpersonal relationships. Meaning (generally speaking) : "people talking in rooms".

I agree with you that Nolan was very obviously inspired by PTA. Dunkirk and Oppenheimer are the products of what I call the "humanist" Nolan. It is very obviously apparent—and Nolan would be the first to admit it—that the humanist PTA's storytelling, particularly in TWBB, inspired Nolan's approach to Oppenheimer. This is how it should be. Just as Coleridge took a cue from Wordsworth, or Samuel Beckett from Joyce, or Brahms from Beethoven, and so on and so forth. The best artists teach one another how to become better. The best artists inspire each other, and then they inspire us. Everybody wins.

Also note that TWBB was PTA's first literary adaptation. Same goes for Nolan and Oppenheimer. What does this mean? Adapting a ready-made narrative freed up a little bit of these artists' mind to go in directions possibly otherwise uninvestigated. Nolan uses his source material wonderfully well while following it judiciously, while PTA leaps off from his source material—almost right at the start!—to such an extent that the screenplay is almost an original.

These two storytellers are now fully grown-up. What they know now can't be taught. Who knows what riches they might produce. It seems unthinkable that PTA might make another film as accomplished as Phantom Thread—it's Sophocles, after all—but in these incredible times most anything might happen so it's absolutely not out of the question that PTA might surprise us with Genius Beyond Comprehension. But he doesn't have to go that far to impress us. But Scroob has no idea what the concept of "further" means with respect to PTA. Scroob remembers translating Homer. Back in the ancient evenings during the translations of the Odyssey and the Iliad, Scrooby often speculated where Homer might go next. Only twice in these two epic works was Scrooby correct in his assessment. Only twice. And each epic has something like 12,000–15,000 lines or whatever. So that's a lot of wrong guesses, or indeterminacy—or, to put it another way—that's a lot of genius storytelling. Homer was an ever-flowing fount of surprise. Similarly, PTA. It would be foolhardy to predict what an artist who took on Sophocles and won will do next. Anyway, a great work of art always comes as a surprise.

I have made the case before and I will make it again, if need be : Phantom Thread confirms PTA as our best living storyteller in film. I would go so far as to say that PTA—or possibly the humanist Nolan—might one day be up for a Nobel Prize in Literature (if we accept a film as a "filmed play"—because playwrights can win the Nobel Prize. Eugene O'Neill did).

Yes, Phantom Thread confirms PTA as our best storyteller—though Nolan is the most popular in the world right now. Please let us agree that there can be no worthier subject matter than Oppenheimer : the film is founded in so many fundamental story principles that it can serve as a three-year course in storytelling. And the film promotes scholastic study—the most worthy encouragement of all. (The promotion of scholastic study has a philosophic primacy over whatever it is that might be studied.) Elsewhere Scroob has defined Oppenheimer as the most distinguished blockbuster in Hollywood history.

One comment on one comment : "[PTA] could care less about conventional box office success". Let's say you're one hundred percent correct. Fact remains, though, that PTA will never get the budgets that Nolan enjoys unless PTA begins selling tickets. Phantom Thread made only $40 mil worldwide or thereabouts. Such a gross will not inspire studios to open their purse strings. Possibly PTA doesn't want a colossal budget because he is content with intimate stories. On the other hand, who can say that PTA doesn't have a 2001 : A Space Odyssey inside of him, but which needs a budget of big $$$ for it to be realized?

The colossal, and colossally unanticipated, storytelling success of Oppenheimer may have jolted PTA to some degree. What will he do? Scroob hopes he continues along the trajectory of Phantom Thread—exploring one subject in depth : the complexity of adult relationships. That is first-rate storytelling, from Aeschylus to the present day. No CGI required.

If Scroob had to speculate, Scroob would say : PTA is about to produce something as dense and complex and wondrous as Phantom Thread. But even though we might see it, we might not know what we have seen for years. PTA is ahead of Nolan, and PTA is ahead of us.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWvX4M1dXss