The winnah and champeen.......Spike Jonze! I find Lee's films whiney and preachy. I also thought he was very bitchy about how many times Sam Jackson used the word "nigger" in Jackie Brown. He implied that QT was a racist. Hmmm, that would make SL not only preachy, whiney and bitchy, but stupid as well! QT is not a racist. Spike Jonze gave us Being John Malkovich!!!!! I love that flick!!!! John Cusack rules!!!
Quote from: Steve McQueen's ghostnigger
I only quoted the word. It is NOT a part of my vocabulary.
Spike Jonze has directed two very good movies. Spike Lee has directed at least two very good movies: Crooklyn and Summer of Sam. 25th Hour and Do the Right Thing certainly count as "good," too, so... I'd say Spike Lee is "ahead," at least.
He also probably looks at the world outside his window more often than Jonze (or Tarantino) does, which I think is a valuable trait despite his occasional self-righteousness.
I saw Lee speak once....I thought it was gonna be about film, instead I left hating the fact that I was a white man. I like his films, but he needs to shut the fuck up at times...
Jonze....I have nothing but good thoughts of, and love his films.
As I said, Spike is very preachy. Oh yeah, aclockworkjj, I believe you owe Spike Lee an apology......for being white.
I have found Spike Lee preachy at times, but never has anything he's said made me feel bad about being white. Some people are just silly about race, and there are a whole lot of people of other races a whole lot sillier than Spike Lee about it. I would never say he's "very" preachy; I'd say he's "somewhat" "occasionally" preachy. Let's not paint with too broad a brush.
Quote from: godardianthere are a whole lot of people of other races a whole lot sillier than Spike Lee about it.
totally....I agree completely.
But the hour and a half I heard him...I felt like I had been born with a silver spoon...and that's not the case.
He basically went off about how inner city kids don't have opprotunities to learn film. Sorry, but the school I went to was not hard to get into (only need a 19 on yer ACT or decent grades) as well as it was a cheap school, the loan anyone is eligible for covered almost most of the tution..so I have very little simpathy in those respects...
I guess I just wish he woulda talked more about his films or maybe his time at Morehouse.
Well, I don't think we can compare these two... Spike directed many more films, and I love many of them. Yes, he may talk waaaay to much, but I can separate the two things quite easily. Jonze did two truly amazing films, but we need to see more to be able to compare. Personally, I don't think I'll ever say that one is better than the other... My first impression is: they're different
QuoteJohn Cusack rules!!!
Yeeeeees he does.
I even liked the Levis commercial Jonze did....not to mention the Ikea one.
I'll take Spike Lee simply on the fact he has made good movies. I still have yet to believe Jonze has even made a good movie: both movies are half baked in a sense they only seem like they stand on cute ideas for a plot and the actors walk around bragging about the cuteness. Adaptation faultered in that it thought of a good ending, an ending ala 8 1/2 but more for cleverness. To build up to the "fantastic" ending, they had the general conflict of art/hollywood. It was just all general talk without delving into anything beyond that general notion. Being John Malkovich just rested on the comedic idea of going into John Malkovich's head and exploring weird things that could come from it. It spent half the movie explaining the thing and the rest just building up a pretty airy human drama out of it. Short film extended, really.
I do have many problems with Lee films. I didn't like The 25th Hour nor did think many of his other greats were all that great. I need to revisit some, though. But he made Do the Right Thing and alone that movie brings him ahead of Jonze.
~rougerum
Hey RoyalTenenbaum,
Have ever seen Cusack give a bad performance? No. He's been in films that may not have beed that good, but he never gives a bad performance.
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I think that Chris Rock's character in Jay and Silent Bob Strikes Back was based on Spike Lee. LOL!!!! :-)
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I don't think that there is a problem with race in films. The same is true for whites and blacks. Some are over-rated and some are ignored.
Denzel Wasington farts and the critics swoon. Sam Jackson gives a great performance and is ignored.
Tom Hanks farts and the critics swoon. Michael Caine or Harrison Ford give a great performance and get ignored.
Incidentally, I find it INCREDIBLE that Washington gives a weird Sam Jackson impression in Training Day and gets a freaking Oscar for it!
Quote from: Steve McQueen's ghostnigger
:(
I'll take this opportunity to brag for my friend, who was cast as an extra in Spike Lee's upcoming film and got to have lunch with Spike and crew. Her words that they took forever to set up, but when they were done she was allowed to stay as long as she liked to watch the remaining scenes/set-ups.
Spike Jonze seems like a cool man. He gave a great interview on that Being John Malkovich DVD. Most interviews are just pricks talking about their love for working with another, but Jonze said it like it is on that DVD, holding nothing back.
WTF is the point of this thread? The only thing similar between these two filmmakers is their chosen moniker. We should be having more productive debates... like which Paul Anderson is better :roll:
i cannot think of two working filmmakers more dissimilar than them...
one focuses on ironic yet, as goldtrumpet put it, "cutesy" movies, the other is a social commentator and inarguably one of the most controversial public figures on the topic of race in America. both make films for different reasons about different things in different ways.
I think Jonze has done a lot better in the 4 years that he's been making feature films than Lee has in his whole career...not even considering the stuff Spike Jonze did before that. When you do factor in Jonze's brilliant pre-feature filmography (his music videos), it makes it even more embarassing.
Jungle Fever, Do the Right Thing, and 25th Hour are Spike Lee's only good films imo...so far I mean. And I'll admit, I haven't seen them all. I have yet to see Bamboozled, Girl 6, Crooklyn, and some others.
..spike jonze..he's 2 for 2
and he is not that bad of an actor...
I think its racist of Lee to call Tarantino a racist for using the term nigga repeatedly in a film when he uses it in films HEAPS. So its okay for a black film maker to use that term but not for a white one? Bullshit.
QuoteI think its racist of Lee to call Tarantino a racist for using the term nigga repeatedly in a film when he uses it in films HEAPS. So its okay for a black film maker to use that term but not for a white one? Bullshit.
Totally agree. Actually, I think it's a shame for Spike to make such ridiculous statements. Lucky for us that he doesn't pass that kind of ideias into his films. I mean, he does make films about racism, but usually in his films, he tries to explain it and tries to show howstupid the whole racism thing is. Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to do thesame whenever he does an interview.
Its pretty hard to refine something on the spot when you feel so passionate about it. Lee can be just as critical of himself about racism. On the Criterion of Do the Right Thing he mentions how in some of his films he has aided in perpetuating certain racial stereotypes.
J comes before L in the alphabet, so I'd have to go with Jonze. Next -Keaton or Chaplin....
Spike Jonze took a shit today, and it was beautiful.
Quote from: oakmanc234I think its racist of Lee to call Tarantino a racist for using the term nigga repeatedly in a film when he uses it in films HEAPS. So its okay for a black film maker to use that term but not for a white one? Bullshit.
it isnt racist of him, just hypocritical of him
Quote from: ebeaman
Jungle Fever, Do the Right Thing, and 25th Hour are Spike Lee's only good films imo...so far I mean. And I'll admit, I haven't seen them all. I have yet to see Bamboozled, Girl 6, Crooklyn, and some others.
Crooklyn and Get on the Bus were good.
Quote from: RaviQuote from: ebeaman
Jungle Fever, Do the Right Thing, and 25th Hour are Spike Lee's only good films imo...so far I mean. And I'll admit, I haven't seen them all. I have yet to see Bamboozled, Girl 6, Crooklyn, and some others.
Crooklyn and Get on the Bus were good.
Malcolm X
4 Little Girls
and Summer of Sam, while by no means a perfect film, is better than most of the dreck that gets released these days
I'm a Spike Lee fan, for sure.
I like a gang of Lee films too realize.
Like:
Mo Better, Right Thing, X, 25th Hour, and Summer of Sam (which I felt was underrated)...shit I even liked He Got Game (Ray Allen is muy boy!!).
I just wish he would just "be a filmmaker".
um, why r we comparing these two, cuz they're both named spike? stupit.
to deny lee's contribution not only to african american cinema but to american cinema itself is even stupider.
and perhaps the stupidest thing yet:
Quote from: Steve McQueen's ghostThe winnah and champeen.......Spike Jonze! I find Lee's films whiney and preachy. I also thought he was very bitchy about how many times Sam Jackson used the word "nigger" in Jackie Brown. He implied that QT was a racist. Hmmm, that would make SL not only preachy, whiney and bitchy, but stupid as well! QT is not a racist. Spike Jonze gave us Being John Malkovich!!!!! I love that flick!!!! John Cusack rules!!!
Wow, I missed this thread all this time. I got some things to say on it.
Spike Lee is light years ahead of Spike Jonze. Spike Lee is aware of his surroundings and political/social issues, which in turn makes him a great filmmaker seeing as how most of those things are involved in his films. Spike Jonze is the nerdy kid in class with the video camera who would get on your nerves but then made some awesome music videos and commercials, then hooked up with a good writer and made a couple good movies, where the writing was the strong point. Spike Lee did the same thing early on with Public Enemy and the Nike Air Jordan commercials. Each of them are the same for more than one reason, of course one reason is the name, but another is they each have their finger on a pulse. Spike Lee with political/racial/social issues and Spike Jonze with the ever so awesome Paris Hilton like whats hot at the moment. Spike Lee will make you laugh, cry, puke, shit, but most of all, think. Spike Jonze will make you happy that you are young. That's about it really. I'll take Spike Lee for his fantastic work on Crooklyn, Do The Right Thing, Summer Of Sam (underrated as fuck) and the 25th hour. Spike Jonze is good, but he's a wee tyke trying to play with the big boys in this topic. Spike Jonze exudes creativity, and Spike Lee exudes emotion, the thing is, Spike Lee can exude all the same things Spike Jonze can, and he can do it in a way that is relevant, as oppose to shits and giggles. Spike Lee is the meat while Spike Jonze is the potatoes.
this thread doesn't have anything to do with anything
however, while we're on the subject of racism. I find it interesting that spike lee is directing material from james ellroy, who I believe is pretty open about his racism towards african americans.