Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of The Sith

[Redlum]

Episode I is on tv this afternoon and Im looking forward to seeing it again for the first time in about four years. Particulalrly in light of what you said about the intergration of puppets, Bonanzataz. The fact that the prequels feel so completely different to the originals is largely because of their effects strategies, you're right. Is it one of those Jaws things, though - where had it have been working more often we might have lost some of the great character scenes and moments with Quint, Hooper and Brody? Was it just the "limitations" at the time that stopped Lucas from making the originals(quoting Spaced) a "jumped up firework display of a toy advert"

[Ultrahip]

um, what the hell was general grievous?

the accent? the smokers cough? droids don't have lungs, do they? was that just crockety machinery whirring through some sort of human diaphragm? if so, it was poorly explained.

and what of the walk? it just doesn't make sense that a machine could stride like that. the screws and bolts would have to be like, made of jello.

also, what the hell was obi-wan's tropical-green braying gecko? it belonged in the life aquatic. i half-expected obi-wan to turn to the clones, "go get some hot milk."

whatever. the movie was mainly entertaining.

[Kal]

WARNING SPOILERS


picolas, I agree with you about the reasons why Anakin turned bad and why does he continue after Padme's death. But its obvious that by then he has nowhere else to go. Everyone he knows is death. Also, by the time he is about to fight Obi Wan, he forgot the reason why he even turned to the dark side besides Padme's health. He talks about being the Emperor.

Then I guess the reason why she is not mentioned again is because Episode 4 starts almost 20 years after 3 ended, so by then there is very little left of Anakin. It all starts coming back with the appearence of Luke.

Ultrahip, Grevious was an outdated version of Darth Vader. He wasnt so powerful, but he was a Sith, and he probably had an accident and was reconstructed as a droid. But they show how he had heart and lungs and everything under the metal. They show his transofrmation or history in the Clone Wars I think.

[Pubrick]

NOTE: if ur not writing long thought-out reviews like picol, bonz, rk, or at least responding to them, ur talking to urself in this thread. so far they hav all spoken truth, and the best discussions are coming out of their points. just a heads up for those joining us late.

andyk's explanation of grevious just now reminded me of what is so great about the original movies. basically what bonz said, and this pico part:

the audience would be thrust into a place where they don't quite know what's happened before and no one takes any time to explain how everything works or why the empire is in control or whatever. giving episode IV, V, and VI a context negates that wonderful premise. that mystery is part of what made Vader such an awesome villain.

the prequels have lost the feeling of mythology. which is what ur describing. that andyk had to explain what the hell grevious was just proves ur last sentence, the prequels themselves present the problem of having no wonder ahead, only a fog behind the characters.

the more i think about it, the more the star wars saga would work better as a bedtime story.

[Gamblour.]

I was wondering why there was a fucking coughing robot.

To go with the idea of the prequels as the 'fact behind the mythology', has there ever been a film or series of films to both exhibit mythology and explain it, and have it all still work? I know this is a broad question, but...

a film trilogy like the matrix works the same as star wars. The first Matrix was shrouded in myth, mystic cities like Zion, under-the-table handshakes with Cypher and Agent Smith, etc. Then, here comes Reloaded and Revolutions explaining the fun away from everything, and crapping everything up. My roommate thinks they were ruined due to a lack of creative control on the part of producers. This flies in the face of 'independent' thinking in cinema, where the director should have control. However, if given control, Lucas and the Wachowskis make movies that don't touch the originals.

Now, should a story like the prequels have even been told in the first place? I think the story is incredibly interesting, a chosen one falling from grace into evil. That's a killer fucking story. But Lucas has just told it poorly, so very poorly. I think this guy is given the benefit of the doubt way too much, people are far too forgiving, these movies have no impact, emotionally.

[Recce]

I enjoyed it, but definitely agree there are some...issues.

Spoiler****
For example, what the hell was up with the scene where skywalker finds out that palpatine is the sith lord? He pulls his light saber and stuff, they talk and palpatine says he can help him save his wife, then it cuts to obi wan i think, then back to skywalker telling windu about palpatine. Um, so, how exactly did that go 'wait here, sith lord, i'm going to tell mace windu about this'. It felt like they couldn't think of a good enough reason for skywalker to leave him there, so they just distracted us with something else and hoped we wouldn't notice.

I also agree that skywalkers turn to the dark side was way to sudden and not motivated. when mace windu dies and the emperor tells skywalker soemthing to the effect of 'well, i don't actually know how to cheat death, but im sure i can figure it out', it felt like skywalker should have cut his head off. i think they should have played more on skywalkers lust for power to turn him rather then some trumped up desire to save padme. (btw, natalie portman was way underused as the stay at home wife in this one).

The death of all the jedi could have been better. since episode 2, it occured to me that all the jedi would have to be killed in epi 3, so i was expecting these crazy battles. while it was sad and dramatic to see them all get betrayed like that, they all fell way too easily. it would have been cooler to see the jedi come very close to making it out alive, but not quite making it rather then just get shot in the back. can't they sense when these things are going to happen?

Also, what was with the battle between yoda and the emperor. yoda falls down the shaft thing, he runs away and says he has to go into exile. Um, feel like trying again, maybe? It really cheapened the image of yoda for me. before this film, i would have expected yoda to die rather then leave the emperor in charge. I understand they had to set things up for the first three films, but making him give up that easily jsut ruined it for me.

On a positive note, i was really happy with the battle between obi wan and skywalker. it was as dramatic as i hoped it would have been. Seeing how they handled some of the other stuff, i was afraid they would trivialized it, but it worked well.

Best moment: yoda walking into the emperors chamber and throwing those two guards against the wall, knocking them out.

Worst moment: Vader's big 'noooooo!' when he hears that padmes dead.

Most dramatic moment: Obi Wan's 'You were the chosen one!', followed by skywalkers 'I hate you!'.

Cheasy forced moment: 'Wipe the protocol droids memory' (convenient and uncalled for. at least change it to 'Wipe the protocols droids memory. He's seen to much').

Bold statement on my part: Lucas is not a very good director. I mean, look at the two best Star Wars film, epi. 5 and 6, the only two that weren't directed by him. I thought he had decided to leave epi.3 to some else? What happened?

[modage]

My roommate thinks they were ruined due to a lack of creative control on the part of producers. This flies in the face of 'independent' thinking in cinema, where the director should have control. However, if given control, Lucas and the Wachowskis make movies that don't touch the originals.

interesting theory.  especially because Lucas says on the Moviefone UnScripted thing...

"When I did Episode I, there were a lot of people around in various departments that were very upset. They said i was going to destory the series because nobody wanted to see a movie about a 9 year old boy.  I'm sure if I had been at a studio they wouldnt have let me do that.  I'm sure a lot of the fans might've appreciated that.   But I wanted to tell the story of Anakin and I wanted to start it with him as a 9 year old boy.  Even though it wasnt the most popular decision, it was my decision.   It was the way I wanted to do it."

damn, who would've thought studio interference COULD've been a good thing?

also:  

"I don't like beginnings.  I like to cut right into the middle of the action.  I dont like to do the exposition part.  BUT, if you start in Episode IV you still have to write the backstory, the exposition in order to know where you're going.  You do a little profile on each of the characters: who they are, where they came from, what their feelings are about things.  And in this case the politcal atmosphere of the Republic and the Empire.  And that really was the backstory.  When I finished Star Wars, (ROTJ ) I figured that was it.  I never expected to turn the backstory into a movie.  But, as time went on and i realized the icon of the evil darth vader so overwhelmed this character. that the idea that he is actually a tragic character, its there, but it got lost.  Overwhelmed I should say.  So by going back and telling this story, the Darth Vader story, the whole story from the very beginning i was able to get the full range of all the things that wer going on and how they fit together."  

he says right there, he doesnt like beginnings or exposition.  which is, you know EP'S I & II!!!  hmm... i wonder why they don't seem as interesting...

besides, he was still technically Anakin after he turned into Vadar.........

It's the soul of the person (Jedi), not the physicality.

George confirms macs theory on why its hayden at the end of ROTJ...

"The idea was that your inner person would go back to where we left off.  before you turned to the dark side.  So when you go back to the good side of the force, that its your former persona that survives.  Not your Darth Vader persona."

http://movies.channel.aol.com/feature/starwars/unscripted.adp

[Gamblour.]

Cheasy forced moment: 'Wipe the protocol droids memory' (convenient and uncalled for. at least change it to 'Wipe the protocols droids memory. He's seen to much').

I was awake for that part. It ends with an iris-in on C-3P0's face. It's so awful and cheesy as hell, it looks like a Looney Tunes ending, I expected there to be low-brass doing a chromatic whaa-whaa-whaaaaaaaaaa.

[Myxo]

I believe Lucas could have combined elements of Episode 2 & 3 as a trilogy on their own, without needing to explain how little Anakin grows up. There is a continuity problem with the actors he chose for child Anakin and the young man. I remember in Episode 2, Padme turns to him and she says,

"Ani? You've grown up!"

It's so awkward.

Episode 1 could easily have told the story of Anakin's childhood in flashbacks. Actually, it would have worked perfectly with the moment he goes and rescues his mother in Episode 2. All they'd need is a little 20 minute segment to give us a flashback of their lives as slaves before he goes on a killing spree.

How about Ewan Mcgregor as Obi-Wan? Now that all three films are behind us, was he cast well? I'm not sure I believe the old man is the same person who Christensen portrays.

Also, I was hoping to see a small Yoda moment where he goes into exile on Dagobah. Instead all we get is a small line telling us that he has to go. Kinda lame..

They could have easily made the war with the Wookies much, much cooler and spent more time with Chewbacca. Everything just felt way too rushed. I love the film, don't get me wrong. I had a similar experience with Matrix Reloaded as I did with this installment. Both are great films mired down with some really crap dialogue and awkward pacing.

[RegularKarate]

Cheasy forced moment: 'Wipe the protocol droids memory' (convenient and uncalled for. at least change it to 'Wipe the protocols droids memory. He's seen to much').

It's a given that he's seen too much, THAT would be unnecessary.  We already know that they need to protect the location of Luke and the fact that he has a twin sister.  What IS cool about it is the fact that R2's memory isn't erased.  In the originology, R2 always knows what's going on and it even seems that he's trying to explain the past to 3PO, that's why he's always asking R2 "What the fuck are you talking about?".

Bold statement on my part: Lucas is not a very good director. I mean, look at the two best Star Wars film, epi. 5 and 6, the only two that weren't directed by him. I thought he had decided to leave epi.3 to some else? What happened?

I don't think that's very bold.  I think it's commonly accepted.  He WAS a good story teller, never a good director... also New Hope is better than Jedi.

[MacGuffin]

the actor playing luke's dad, Joel Edgerton

I'm sorry, the geek in me has to correct this. If by dad you mean "father figure," then okay, but Anakin is Luke's dad. He's taken in by Uncle Owen and Aunt Beru.


Ahhhhhh... that felt better.

[Stefen]

oh snap.

[picolas]

the person in me has to say that's what he meant.

[MacGuffin]

It was bugging me. I admit, I have OCSWD (Obsessive-Compulsive Star Wars Disorder).




No, you don't.

No, I don't.

You can go about your business.

I'll go about my business.

Move along.

Move along... Move along.

[tpfkabi]

so how much time passes in the film?
SPOILERS





i don't think Padme' has any kind of pregnant belly at the beginning and then she is huge and has twins.