Westworld

Started by Jeremy Blackman, July 07, 2016, 09:53:19 PM

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Jeremy Blackman

Quote from: Tictacbk on November 29, 2016, 11:04:55 AM
And then everyone rewatched the entire season.

For sure. That episode was dizzying in such a wonderful way.

This is what fascinates me most right now. Given Ford's apparent omnipotence, he must be aware of what Maeve is doing, right? Is she perhaps even the centerpiece of his "new narrative"? And is that narrative more meta than we realized? Also, I would bet he's built some kind of backdoor in Maeve, as with Clementine.

I think Westworld is still a little rough around the edges, but I honestly don't care. I don't demand perfection from everything; ambition is more important. We can't take shows like this for granted.
Living life big time

Jeremy Blackman

Yes, yes, yes. This is exactly the kind of finale I wanted. Audacity above all else. That's the show's strength; good that they're sticking with it.

(SPOILS)

A hat brim wipe is always good, but the MIB reveal seemed both overdue and really dumbed down. In GoT, all they had to do was cut from baby Jon's face to adult Jon's face. But this reveal was the equivalent of having Lyanna be like "and you must name him Jon!"

I guess the episode really won me over once I heard that beautiful arrangement of "Exit Music." Everything that followed felt so wonderfully apocalyptic. The last show that accomplished that feeling for me was The Leftovers. It's actually a rare skill that needs to be appreciated. Pulling that off at the end of your first season, no less... not bad.
Living life big time

polkablues

ALSO SPOILERS

I'm really impressed by the way that even though basically every fan theory ended up proving true, it never felt like a letdown when you had that moment of confirmation. Everything was so elegantly laid out, so earned, that even though you knew what the puzzle was going to look like, it still felt satisfying every time a piece clicked into place.

They had one great misdirection up their sleeve, though, and they pulled it out just at the right time. The realization that Maeve's awakening was a red herring all along, that every moment of supposed free will she thought she was experiencing was just a programming trick, that she was never more than a pawn in someone else's endgame. Heartbreaking. And it calls into question every future instance of apparent independent consciousness. The show is taking great pains to make the point that everyone, not just the hosts, is merely playing their part in a story much greater than themselves. I think, moving forward, the core question of the series becomes less "can a robot exhibit free will?" and more "is there such thing as free will?" And then the issue shifts from whether or not a robot can become like a person to whether or not there's a fundamental difference between the two in the first place.

And yeah, the piano/violin version of "Exit Music" was absolute perfection.
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jonas

SPOILERS

Not much to add on what's above, thought the finale was really well done. The last 3 episodes really brought the first season home for me.

Wyatt = Dolores was a nice surprise, but the big one for me was Samurai World!! (or Shogun World?) There was talk when the series started if they would have any other parks and they never really hinted at that until now.

Will have to wait until 2018 for S2 though  :yabbse-sad:
"Mein F├╝hrer, I can walk!" - Dr. Strangelove

Jeremy Blackman

Seems a little spoilery to me, but it's good:


Living life big time

Fernando


WorldForgot

Wow - with Aaron Paul's character introduced we've now entered Philip K Dick arenas of themez in earnest. While previously I found the sci-fi was a pulp-vessel toward existential drama, now there are details of LA + citizen commerce that illuminate tech as coping mechanism beyond the "theme park" retreat.

Jeremy Blackman

Well, this was an excellent season of Westworld. Aaron Paul was absolutely on fire. Somehow he became the soul of the show. Good finale episode, too, especially the last act. Mild spoiler: I can see this working as a series finale, which it just might be, given the state of Warner Brothers combined with this season's abysmal viewership numbers.

Surprising that we didn't talk about Season 2 here. I actually kind of loved it in a masochistic way. The timeline chicanery is gloriously mind-melting, even if it doesn't always play fair. And S2 has insane James Delos!

Season 3, though, while it had some tremendous scenes and episodes, was a half-baked concept. So inessential that barely any of it is carried into Season 4.

And yet, I'll take any episode of Westworld over most TV. Shows like this, even when deeply flawed, should not be taken for granted.

My (semi-controversial?) ranking of seasons, just from memory, would probably be Two, One, Four, Three. Season 1 is a bit overrated and has a lot of stuff that doesn't quite work. (One of their mission statements seems to have been "let's get as many of our actresses naked as humanly possible and awkwardly linger on their bodies for a while.) It also doesn't reach the heights of bonkersdom that Season 2 does.
Living life big time

WorldForgot

While I can vibe with the 'existential' ambition the show tried to thread together this year, this was probably my least favorite season. It had too much 'television' style plotting, shot, reverse-shot lore conversations. Reminded me a bit of that era when Fringe and Lost were trying to get their groove back.

For me rankings are like 2, 3, 1, 4. I think the first season rubbed me the wrong way when I first watched it, but then later seasons lent it better light once I learned more of the park's backstory. At least during the third season I felt that the setting had a purpose. Here the setting felt inconsequential. Even if it hadn't been present in the scripts, it could have been designed to tell a lot more story.

Season four felt so rote with monologues explaining everything. Something I used to really appreciate about this show was that it didn't mind having cryptic mechanics, and it used editing as a means to not have to 'tell' so much when they could 'show'.

Totally agree about Caleb/Aaron Paul. His was one of the few plotlines with a pulse this season. Bernard, Stubbs, Maeve, and Caleb. Everything else fell way too flat for me.

AntiDumbFrogQuestion

this finale felt like watching "Matrix: Resurrections" at some points. Making subpar CG an affectation of the simulation Christina was going thru is a neat idea, but it felt like watching an episode of "Reboot" to me (appropriate?). I still enjoy this show, although with no idea of the direction of next season if it happens, it felt like it dispatched our favorite characters way too quickly and without fanfare. BUT the fact that actors from previous seasons chose to cameo in this episode shows that maybe there will be a build to something more satisfying and character-centric for the potential season 5.
I will say my view of what I value in this show and what it simply a hack at work boils down to watching the subpar-fest that was Lisa Joy's "Reminiscence". She seems like a cool cat, and intelligent, so I feel bad about saying it, but after that movie, it made me question if there is a legit plan for this series, or passion in their execution, or if each greenlit season is being written with shrugs like "Lost", being forced to work production around the rising stars of most of it's cast, or if the creators even care any more.

Regardless of my criticisms, I still wish this show was getting as strong attention as it was in the first couple seasons. It still has something to say!