Author Topic: Synecdoche, New York  (Read 30910 times)

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Gamblour.

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #90 on: December 29, 2008, 08:48:03 AM »
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That's all very bizarre. I did notice she had the strangest tummy, but I thought it was something of Kauffman's because it looked fake and out of place, given how great the rest of her body is.
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MacGuffin

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #91 on: January 21, 2009, 09:23:25 PM »
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Sony has set Synecdoche, New York for release on both DVD and Blu-ray on 3/10 (SRP $28.96 and $39.95). Extras will include 4 featurettes (In and Around Synecdoche, NY, The Story of Caden Cotard, Infectious Diseases in Cattle: Bloggers Roundtable and NFTS/Script Factory Masterclass with Charlie Kaufman).
“Don't think about making art, just get it done. Let everyone else decide if it's good or bad, whether they love it or hate it. While they are deciding, make even more art.” - Andy Warhol


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socketlevel

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #92 on: February 26, 2009, 03:41:23 PM »
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saw it once when it came out, just went back for a 2nd viewing.  I've talked to a lot of my friends and it's been the basis of a lot of debate.  what's sad about this film is that it powerfully enables itself to exist beyond formally articulated criticism, because a lot of the arguments end in a subjective view.

i found it the same as a lot of experimental cinema in that regard, so i find the only way the viewer can gauge a lot of film in this genre is based on a very simple reaction of excitement/boredom.  as a rule, i think pseudo-story/experimental cinema should try to keep the films as short as possible.  true this is actually a rule in most cinema, however in this case and in the case of a lot of Lynch's recent work, it's harder I'm sure as a film maker and editor to distinguish what is fat to cut... because in essence... it's all fat. 

with a more distinct plot it's easy to see what's self indulgent and what is story/character/plot etc... and less is definitely more.  i love this genre, immensely, however i find myself thinking this movie and a film like inland empire fail.  i come to this conclusion based on the simple fact that i got bored, and felt that when themes in the film were explored, the film itself didn't move forward.  one could argue the point of the film is to explore that very notion, and i guess it might be, but that doesn't mean it's any good... or actually might in fact be sophomoric, the kind of idea you'd get after smoking a joint.

like Adolf i enjoy his work a lot, every single Kaufman up to this point.  i disagree with Adolf's opinion that the film got away from him, because it's too crazy for that to be the case.  if it got away from him it'd suck in a bonfire of the vanities kinda way, not suck in a self indulgent it's become lynch kind of way.

i remember reading an interview with spike jonze when adaptation came out and they asked him what it was like to work with Kaufman.  in a quite humorous way jonze told the magazine that he loved it, and loved Kaufman's ideas, but he just had to take out the aliens and the loch ness monster.  at first i thought he was messing around but then i read the original script to being john malchovich and that as well was way more out there.  i enjoyed the script because it wasn't abstract in a bad way, but it was a much more absurdist way of making the same point.  the original ending of eternal sunshine is also a much more extreme version of the same sentiment the final film depicted.  my point is that maybe charlie Kaufman is only great when he's got a sober mind telling him to chill the fuck out and come back a bit.

i appreciate the movie, and I'm amazed he got it made.  i love the spirit of the independent nature of the film and the financial backing gives me hope some great art movies will get made... but sadly i really didn't like this film, it needed a story editor (ie Michel gondry, spike jonze etc...)

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« Last Edit: March 15, 2009, 12:18:26 AM by socketlevel »
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Alexandro

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #93 on: March 13, 2009, 04:58:19 PM »
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I saw it. Felt like a mind fuck. I felt depressed. My initial reaction to it was that it was a misfire. Too much unpleaseantness, too grim, too weird, too much. But honestly I just knew this was something special. So two hours later I saw it again. Now I think is some kind of masterpiece.

It felt way less grim the second time around, I found myself laughing quite a bit, and just absorbing a lot of stuff that went right by me the firs time. I still think the second half drags a little but in any case, this is probably the best film of the year and will very likely live a long life from now on. Maybe it will be recognized as a true masterpiece down the road. I need to see it again a few more times.

Redlum

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #94 on: March 15, 2009, 09:29:18 AM »
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this is probably the best film of the year

I think you're right. I just saw this last night and I was sure nothing would dislodge Wall-e as my pick of 2008. Right now they both stand tall together. The scope of this film was huge and impossible for me to fully absorb with one viewing. I also feel like I need to watch I Heart Huckabees immediately after next time, just to keep me on an even keal.
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Reinhold

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #95 on: April 08, 2009, 08:33:29 AM »
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spoilers


It made me laugh a lot. I thought that when she demands him to ask for forgiveness, and then she denies him anyway, I thought that was funny. I dunno. And i guess the house was on fire because that's like things in life we get into knowing they'll kill us? Who knows.


my take on the fire is that it was there to ambiguate narrative deadlines but not undercut their significance.
Obviously what you are doing right now is called (in my upcoming book of psychology at least) validation. I think it's a normal thing to do. People will reply, say anything, and then you're gonna do what you were subconsciently thinking of doing all along.

Stefen

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #96 on: June 22, 2009, 09:32:42 AM »
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There has never been a movie that pissed me off more than this one. For the last hour I was yelling at the television and throwing shit at it. I was pulling out my hair. At one point, I even grabbed a pen and paper and began writing a death threat Attn: Charlie Kaufman.

I never turned the movie off.

I need to watch it again.
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Ordet

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #97 on: August 25, 2009, 10:17:31 PM »
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Just saw this a few days ago in theaters. It finally arrived here and… I still don't know what to think about it. My girlfriend says it's her favorite Kaufman movie. I guess it's mine too.  The theater was packed I was glad to see that. I was annoyed though of all the people who walked out when the movie had  5 min remaining . Idiots they stayed for most of the movie. They probably thought it had two more hours to go. Anyway I understand why some people hate it, or don't care for the characters or simply can't get into it. However it has many qualities. To me it's all experienced through Caden's mind that's why it has somewhat of a realistic/surreal/dull feel to it. I loved how Emily Watson played her part, all the actors are great. The point of Caden's play is not really to be shown to an audience but to keep growing and growing and rehearsing and rehearsing. People begin to leave him or die and they see that this is his never ending pattern. And life is very much like that. We're always working towards our specific goals, if we reach them or not we keep doing the same thing over and over again. It can also be said that it's a dream movie however I believe it goes beyond that. Then again the tediousness the film has in certain moments to me is a choice by Kaufman. I thought the use of sound was magnificent and Brion's score is one of his best.
I loved Dianne Wiest's performance and her voice over sequence, her voice is just so sweat. Towards the end in the final monologue of “The specifics hardly matter. Everyone is everyone.”  I have to admit I bawled my eyes out. She says: “as you learn that there was no one watching you and there never was.” To me the mother in Ellen's dream maybe God. But that's just me.

Oh yeah I really don't have to say this but PSH is probably the best actor out there along with DDL.

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Neil

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #98 on: August 19, 2011, 01:03:06 AM »
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Look, i'm sorry for not reading the rest of this thread.  I intend to do it soon. but i just walked out of the room from which i watched this.  It is 12:58 am on Friday, August 19th


I just want to know some complaints about this film.  The reason i ask is because this is one of the best things ever done with film in my opinion.  I just can't even begin to discuss how just 'OUT THERE' the film is without dwelling on surrealism

I recently watched 'jules and vern' and i found myself taken aback by the way that film plays out.  Now i don't know much about new wave cinema but my point here is nothing is dwelled upon.  Any relationship or scenario just resolves so quickly. 

It makes me think that if one were to remember it, their memory would work the same way and that is what i loved about this film.

The things taking place seem so quick, but it's just one mans perspective based on memory, and despite the fact that caden's memory is pretty accurate, it just seems so true to the recollection of a story.

God i hope some of this makes sense, but i know it doesn't

Long story long;  i loved every single thing about this film.

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Jeremy Blackman

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #99 on: August 19, 2011, 01:23:05 AM »
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I still think this movie is a fraud. It doesn't really have anything interesting to say and it takes forever to say it in the most boring, intolerably sentimental way possible. Its gimmick, rather than being exciting and profound like the similar gimmick in The Sea That Thinks, simply collapses into a joyless heap.
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72teeth

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #100 on: August 19, 2011, 01:25:15 AM »
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@Neil:

thats awesome, i just recently re-saw this not too long ago and i definitely found it better the second time around... that scene between Caden and his daughter is so sad and telling of a father's/man's fear of masculinity, i cant believe it didn't strike me before. I didn't respect most Kubricks the first time around either...
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Pubrick

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #101 on: August 19, 2011, 02:54:14 AM »
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I recently watched 'jules and vern'

Jules Verne is a famous author.

Jules et Jim (Jules and Jim) is a film by Francois Truffaut.

Jules and Verne Brown are the names of Doc Brown's kids at the end of Back to the Future part III.
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Neil

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #102 on: August 19, 2011, 11:49:45 AM »
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SPOILERS


Sorry, I meant jules and jim.  Thanks p, i'm not sure why i typed that, it was late and i was trying to type quickly just before i went to bed.  That's why the only real content you saw worth discussing was a mis typed title.

What i was trying to say about jules and jim is whenever Jim meets Marianne, it all happens so quick, she runs away from the anarchist, ends up in jims room shows him the steam boat (which is supposed to be something special) and then it's over.  But, it was a 'thing' that happened.  By a 'thing' i mean an event where we can assume that more happened than what the audience saw on the screen, but if I were retelling the story or looking back (if it happened to me) it would all seem like it happened so quick.  Those are the details I would include for sure at least. 

I got the same feeling from this film for some reason

I still think this movie is a fraud. It doesn't really have anything interesting to say and it takes forever to say it in the most boring, intolerably sentimental way possible. Its gimmick, rather than being exciting and profound like the similar gimmick in The Sea That Thinks, simply collapses into a joyless heap.

as far as a 'joyless heap' goes.  The film is quite joyless and i think it is intended to be that way.  It's about a depressing life that keeps getting worse.  Maybe that is a bit over the top, but then you look at the surreal aspects of the film and one can let that intense self loathing play out. IMO

I think it has a lot of interesting things to say, maybe not necessarily deep philosophical questions that relate to all of us, although i'm sure it does, i've only watched it once, but more so it has things to say in the same way we're supposed to care about cobb in inception.  The real emotion is sometimes taking a backseat to some visual aspects, but still there are questions about letting go of the past, about what makes a person who they are.  Inception has much more eye candy so, it gets tough to swing back and forth between visual awesomeness and emotion.  This film has it both ways, from the surreal sets to just raw real moments.

I'm not familiar with the sea that thinks, and JB i'm not sure what is fraudulent about it.  The film does not seem to dwell on the things that most film makers would in the sense that the reactions characters should have are blank and it's left for the audience to react. That's why i think it works because crazy things happen, like real surreal things and then we just move on at the snap of a finger. 

For instance, it seems like most people with some of the ideas in this film would have been like, "oh we can make hazels house be on fire and it can be this big deal to show how obscure and metaphoric i can be, while having an interesting set piece."  But, the Realtor explains it with, "it's a tough choice choosing how you're going to die." and then it just happens throughout the film, and it is juxtaposed with scenes that are 'normal' . 

I'm not sure if that makes any sense, but for instance in the scene that 72teeth spoke about, it's just something completely different.  I have never seen a relationship like that on screen that ends up like that.  He basically has to admit and apologize for leaving his daughter with his homosexual partner, two things that just are far from true.  So he does it, and not only does olive negate his attempt at forgiveness, but she dies and then there is another tiny bit of surrealism that isn't something to dwell on. She dies and a dead black flower falls off her tattoo onto the hospital bed.

I don't know, i've just never seen anything like this.  I plan on watching the sea that thinks, but if anyone else knows of something similar to this, post it up, i'd love to try to get a better idea of what's going on.

Again a whole bunch of words that probably say nothing which will probably kill this thread, but now to read the rest of it.
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polkablues

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #103 on: August 19, 2011, 01:13:38 PM »
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Well, I've had the blu-ray of this for a couple months and haven't gotten around to watching it, and now I'm all geared up to see it, so you accomplished that at least.
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picolas

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Re: Synecdoche, New York
« Reply #104 on: August 19, 2011, 02:33:02 PM »
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i did a total 180 on this. i felt exactly the way jb feels when i left the theatre and for many months afterwards. now i think it's a big 'ol masterpiece. i don't want to write an essay about it right now, but the thing that began to unlock it for me was kaufman describing a theme of the movie as 'the negative aspects of total artistic freedom/creative control'. it's also about the futility of building 'masterpieces' when we're already part of the biggest work of art ever, a work of art that is constantly changing. eg. the apocalyptic future that caden has no time to incorporate into his piece, which eventually overwhelms and destroys it, making it irrelevant on many levels. this is kind of a giant metaphor for caden's inability to accept dirt and decay, and his secret passion for cleaning and basically keeping everything the same, which is also futile. deep down he wants to be a cleaning lady, and this idea stares him right in the face throughout the film, but he refuses to accept it as his true calling. keener's character suggests that the only way to be a successful artist is through specificity. eg. narrowing and reflecting reality into tiny paintings, NOT obsessively recreating the universe. even though we'd all like to do that, it's the coward's (cotard's) way out.

 

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