Author Topic: toilets (usurped by P)  (Read 9295 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

mutinyco

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
  • Respect: +2
    • http://www.crossoverfollowing.com
toilets (usurped by P)
« on: July 24, 2003, 03:53:29 PM »
0
Anybody notice how often he set scenes in bathrooms?
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

SoNowThen

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 4536
  • Respect: +9
    • 24/30 Cinema
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2003, 03:55:30 PM »
0
Quote from: mutinyco
Anybody notice how often he set scenes in bathrooms?


...and how they're always sparkling clean?
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

mutinyco

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
  • Respect: +2
    • http://www.crossoverfollowing.com
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2003, 05:17:48 PM »
0
Yeah, I gotta find out who his house cleaner was...
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

Pubrick

  • Admin
  • *****
  • Posts: 12170
  • Lynchian identity mystery
  • Respect: +769
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2003, 04:54:25 AM »
0
i was gonna make a topic on this a while back.. then i came to think it was pointing to sumthing greater than what appeared, so i got interested in other things that lay behind the recurring toilet.

here's a few caps* (courtesy of cap man mogwai) and a sample of what i think about it all:
*if u see a red box, right click on it and press "show picture", there is nothing wrong with the links.

Lolita
pristine toilet, just another selling point in the tour of the house (such a commercial environment)..

Sanctuary

intrusion, comedy

the first pic is great, it's the cleanest most pure toilet ever in a kubrick film, without a trace of dark connotations - apart from it's blatant fakeness. then humbert begins impurifying it with his thoughts, writing in there about his sickkkk shit. finally it becomes a den of lies and hilarity, humbert trying to keep cool in more ways than one.. riding out the fortunate loss of his wife.

strangelove
- george and chick in mirror:

ripper suicide

there nearly wasn't a toilet in this one, but as it happens they only occur in reflections, george c scott in the background is in another room. this also happens to be the only scene with a woman in the film, and she's practically a servant.. even her voice changes between 2 distinct personalities. mandrake is grovelling for the secret Ripper is keeping, and which is taken to his grave. luckily outside, the reflection of his insanity is neatly arranged into a crossword.

2001
- a gravity toilet:

- an old fart:

the first one is a joke, but it rings true. and the second one is, like many things in this film, a sign of things to come for kubrick's career, the significance of toilet shots, and everyone else really.

clockwork
- alex slash:

- bathing:

the first one is the most natural of all toilet shots used by kubrick, like a drunk man taking a leak, it feels good.. the second one is where alex lulled into a comfort zone, slips and without knowing it brings his downfall.

barry lyndon
- and lady lyndon:

- shaving:

bad things a comin, the first one takes place after barry is caught cheating on lady lyndon. he apologises here but we don't believe him. in the second, half-shaven barry is told of the news of his son's disobedience.. and his worst fears are realised.

the shining
- danny and tony:

- sexy chick becomes a scary chick:

- 2222-222:

- no way out:

the king of all toilet films. the shining was made to revolve around this place. the first one is the first "supernatural" moment of the film, 'tony' the being who lives in Danny's mouth is telling him while he brushes, that the overlook is a bad place.. and we see the first flashes of blood, girls, and danny frozen in fright. the second, the temptress becomes the monster, shapeshifting encounter in room 237 when jack is drawn in by the beauty and repelled by the beast.. the same person. the third, jack meets delbert grady, formerly identified as charles, in another scene of duality feeling as jagged as the decor itself. and finally, the peak of the toilets in the film, wendy is trapped by snow while jack goes homicidal through the door, she slices him but screams as tho she was cut herself.. the most stuck moment in cinema history, and then jack freezes.

full metal jacket
trying to connect

- here we go:

- after
firstly joker is voicing his concern or at least a noted observation on pyle's sanity, quickly glazed over with dreams of Cowboy's sister's rottencrotch. then  it's pyle's suicide, sgt hartman dead. joker mercifully left alive. it had to happen. the effects echo through the rest of the film, including the final mercy killing.

eyes wide shut
- alice not happy:

- reflection:

here's the last of kubrick toilet scenes, it's also his first film set "now" since dr strangelove. as such the toilet shots again present us with the objectification of women, seen as an obscure object of desire which began in Barry Lyndon, and perfected in the shining (sexy/scary chick). the first here is as a beautiful statue so perfectly stuck in a beautiful pose that bill doesn't need to see her. the second, a different sort of statue, looking for signs of life bill only requires a nod of the head. by now of course, the toilet thing has run its course, kubrick only uses it twice in major scenes and occasionally in the background of the bedroom scenes. they are both very unconventional uses, EWS completes the cycle as his most revealing and ambiguous film. i'm in awe of how much there is to discover here

SO
what i've found about the toilet scenes is sumthing that lies at the core of kubrick's meditation on the dark side of man. in his case the animalistic, beastly nature. this raw unpredictability which is at once scary, fascinating, mysterious, and objectively beautiful. the illusion that we create, that we can ever be pure again. the toilet scenes themselevs are only the tip of the iceberg in all his films, and this is only meant to suggest the depths of what is really going on. to say he only puts them in there "cos it's a part of everyday life" is to not understand life at all, at least not the conscious part. after watching all his films countless times, u begin to notice more of what have been labelled trademarks: sum are recurring themes (plans gone wrong), sum are classic images (kubrick stare), sum are just jokes (CRM-114), but they all contribute to inmeasurably dense works of art. now, if u don't see any meaning in his works, fine, walk on, just consider this.. i'm not lying, and kubrick wasn't either.
endless 'nothing is what it seems'-isms

TheVoiceOfNick

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 1087
  • Respect: +2
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2003, 12:41:43 PM »
0
I thought he showed toilet scenes because he knew that was a part of everyone's life, and its senseless to exclude that from the story.

Nick

ębrad

  • Admin
  • *****
  • Posts: 4506
  • Respect: +218
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2003, 03:26:24 PM »
0
Quote from: męgwai
good job, my friend. you write the verses and i write the choruses.


amen.

modage

  • Admin
  • *****
  • Posts: 10761
  • Respect: +698
    • Floating Heads
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2003, 05:52:21 PM »
0
can i help with the hook?  or atleast the 14 minute guitar solo?
Christopher Nolan's directive was clear to everyone in the cast and crew: Use CGI only as a last resort.

jokerspath

  • The Meeting with the Goddess
  • ***
  • Posts: 390
  • Respect: 0
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2003, 09:22:00 AM »
0
That was really great, I also appreciate those caps and this thread...

aw
THIS IS NOT AN EXIT

picolas

  • Admin
  • *****
  • Posts: 1752
  • Respect: +103
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2003, 03:04:03 PM »
0
hat fuzz wheely grape.

Fernando

  • satan's little helper
  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 2228
  • Respect: +227
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2003, 04:26:55 PM »
0
Quote from: P
the king of all toilet films. the shining was made to revolve around this place. the first one is the first "supernatural" moment of the film, 'tony' the being who lives in Danny's mouth is telling him while he brushes, that the overlook is a bad place.. and we see the first flashes of blood, girls, and danny frozen in fright. the second, the temptress becomes the monster, shapeshifting encounter in room 237 when jack is drawn in by the beauty and repelled by the beast.. the same person. the third, jack meets delbert grady, formerly identified as charles, in another scene of duality feeling as jagged as the decor itself. and finally, the peak of the toilets in the film, wendy is trapped by snow while jack goes homicidal through the door, she slices him but screams as tho she was cut herself.. the most stuck moment in cinema history, and then jack freezes.


In TS, bathrooms are almost a character, aren't they? Those three scenes you talk about are key scenes in the film, not just fillers (though in K's films we hardly find fillers), the first one (Danny's) prepares you for what is about to come in the film, and in fact the reason of why the film exists, as you said the first glimpse of the supernatural. The Second one with the bathroom lady, she was presented both as a beauty and a monster, but what exactly it means? Isn't the hotel 'on Jack's side'? and more over, Why did Jack lie to Wendy when she asked him about it (room 237)? This could be the pivotal scene that made Jack to finally loose his mind. Third scene, with Grady, might be the key scene to solve this film's puzzle, (with several viewings) we realize that there are three periods of time here 20's, 70's and present, and apparently Jack has always been there as well as Grady.

Quote from: P
EWS the first here is as a beautiful statue so perfectly stuck in a beautiful pose that bill doesn't need to see her.


Exactly, and more than anything what this tells us is that Bill takes things for granted, he doesn't have to look at his wife to know she's beautiful, later on in the bedroom scene he was so confident of what he had that he's sure that Alice wouldn't cheat on him, but not because he's sure of himself but because his wife would never do it, when Alice tells him about her fantasy and that she was willing to risk everything just for a one night stand his confident world falls apart.

Quote from: P
the second, a different sort of statue, looking for signs of life bill only requires a nod of the head. u may say the shining is set in "Now", and ur right, but it's also set in "then" and "soon", otherwise known as Forever.


Interesting, maybe this is related of what I just said, that he took things for granted, even his job, between this scene and Alice's confession we see the daily life of the good Dr., taking care of a child, a beautiful woman and an olderly man, everything without the slightest worry.

Good post P, I'm sure there's more to talk about, we catch up later.

Pubrick

  • Admin
  • *****
  • Posts: 12170
  • Lynchian identity mystery
  • Respect: +769
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2003, 10:03:49 AM »
0
thanks to everybody who read it and got sumthing out of it, as well as those who pretended to read it and then drooled on the keyboard and said sumthing meaningless.

Quote from: Fernando
but what exactly it means? Isn't the hotel 'on Jack's side'? and more over, Why did Jack lie to Wendy when she asked him about it (room 237)?

the hotel, like showbusiness according to George Burns, is a Hideous Bitch Goddess.

Quote from: Fernando
Interesting, maybe this is related of what I just said, that he took things for granted, even his job, between this scene and Alice's confession we see the daily life of the good Dr., taking care of a child, a beautiful woman and an olderly man, everything without the slightest worry.

yeah ur on the right track, but u should expand on the subject of what bill takes for granted to cover his whole journey and ponder specifically what both he and his wife take for granted in the last scene. that's if u wanna follow that train of thought.. ur right, but it's only the beginning of what happens to Bill.

the thing with kubrick is if u do grasp an idea about at least ONE thing that he has shown, it invariably is followed up later on and tied up to the entirety of the picture. so it's easy for everyone to follow one thread and think of it as tying the whole thing together, the way i've tied all the toilets and then made an observation on kubrick's themes in general. i addressed another completely different set of ideas on the AI Observations topic. but the truth is there are many.. so many.

Quote from: jokerspath
I also appreciate those caps

the caps as u know were all mog, he did a great job..
here's an extra couple to reward those who didn't ignore this thread:

It's from the shining documentary by Vivian Kubrick, right at the beginning it follows Jack into his own toilet while he offers to brush his teeth for the camera. he's quite friendly about it. it's the most "unconventional" part of the documentary showing what it's like when kubrick is not around.. everyone is still in his mindscape. the doco must've been cut down to work better as interviews with the rest of the cast, but i think it's wonderful that kubrick's daughter is into toilets too.
endless 'nothing is what it seems'-isms

jokerspath

  • The Meeting with the Goddess
  • ***
  • Posts: 390
  • Respect: 0
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2003, 10:20:50 AM »
0
Quote from: P
Quote from: jokerspath
I also appreciate those caps

the caps as u know were all mog, he did a great job..


He surely did, and excuse me for not thanking him directly.  Thank you Mogwai, visuals help a ton...

aw
THIS IS NOT AN EXIT

TheVoiceOfNick

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 1087
  • Respect: +2
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2003, 10:52:22 AM »
0
Quote from: P
ur on the right track


Is that sort of like "urinary tract"? Sorry... couldn't resist.  :P

Nick

Sleuth

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 3468
  • dead comic genius
  • Respect: +7
    • http://www.conologue.com
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #13 on: July 29, 2003, 11:18:38 AM »
0
Well...you're going to have to try harder next time
I like to hug dogs

mutinyco

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
  • Respect: +2
    • http://www.crossoverfollowing.com
Re: toilets (usurped by P)
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2003, 08:25:37 PM »
0
Man, guess I picked a good topic for this thread. Too tired to contribute anything though.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

 

DMCA & Copyright | Terms & Conditions | Privacy Policy