Author Topic: HDV  (Read 5355 times)

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Redlum

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HDV
« on: May 09, 2005, 05:15:06 PM »
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Has anyone given any of the new HDV cameras a go yet? Im contemplating shooting a short this summer with one of the new Sony cameras and although Ive done hours of research I still have my doubts. Will my pc be able to handle it? If I rent the camera where do I stand on exporting back to tape at the end of the edit?

If anyones been able to use this format yet I'd be grateful to hear your experiences.
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Ghostboy

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« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2005, 05:20:01 PM »
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I haven't used it yet, but word on the street is...don't buy the Sony camera. It sounds like you're not planning on buying it, so that's cool, but if you are, keep in mind that it'll be surpassed by the end of the year by far superior, equally affordable models from JVC and Panasonic (and, it's rumored, the XL-3 may take the cake over all of them). I think the biggest problem with the Sony model is that has that in-camera MPG compression. I think the JVC model is only going to have 720 lines of resolution (versus the Sony's 1080), but the lack of compression makes up for it. And then I hear that the Panasonic will have the full 1080 and no MPG compression at all - how they're doing that, I'm not sure, but it sounds great.

As far as editing goes, I only know about Mac solutions, so if you're on a PC, I can't help....

This is where I go to get all my info, btw: http://hdforindies.com

Chrisdarko

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« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2005, 05:32:53 PM »
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Don't edit on a pc. If thats all you got try to find a friend that has a mac.
Macs are far superior to pc when it comes to editing.

cowboykurtis

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« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2005, 06:01:32 PM »
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i've used it - thre are a lot of problems with it - im not too impressed.

and video looks like shit - so thats that
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RegularKarate

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« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2005, 08:29:57 PM »
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Why were you using it if "video looks like shit"?

Video can look great if you're using it for the right reason and the right way.

However, I agree with GB.... I saw this at an expo and wasn't very impressed and from what I've read, it's going to be majorly surpassed soon.

Redlum

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« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2005, 10:05:49 AM »
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Thanks for the replies, everyone.

Firstly, I'll steer clear of the Mac vs Pc debate. But I will say that Ive been editing with Avid on a pc for years without any problems.

Thanks for the link Ghostboy. The interframe compression is starting to look less and less apealing, and in a way - unnatural. What then would you suggest for someone who'd like to try something with better image quality than miniDV? DVCAM on a PD170? Or another route: An XL1 with Mini35 lens mount (although that comes to £160 a day)?

The XL2 seems to have been a complete waste of time.
\"I wanted to make a film for kids, something that would present them with a kind of elementary morality. Because nowadays nobody bothers to tell those kids, \'Hey, this is right and this is wrong\'.\"
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Ghostboy

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« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2005, 12:11:34 PM »
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Quote from: ®edlum
What then would you suggest for someone who'd like to try something with better image quality than miniDV?


Panasonic DVX-100A is all the rage these days, with good reason.

Redlum

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« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2005, 12:46:51 PM »
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I don't know, Ive used one before and don't think its substantially better. Certainly not enough to warrant a rental over the use of a CanonGL2 that I own.
\"I wanted to make a film for kids, something that would present them with a kind of elementary morality. Because nowadays nobody bothers to tell those kids, \'Hey, this is right and this is wrong\'.\"
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metroshane

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« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2005, 01:20:40 PM »
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I'm not sure I'm all that crazy about HDV.  I used the JVC and had some inconsistancy problems.  Color inconsistency was a big issue.  Two takes of the same set up often had slightly different tones when edited together.  We got a really great film look when we shot in a bar that had lots of low key lighting and some neon colors...but in sunlight or with hot lights...it just didn't hold up.  I think the color band was too wide for it to handle?  Also, it has shutter speed and fstop controls that were basically useless.  You could set one, but the other was set accordingly automatically..making it basically an auto-exposure.  Lots of ghosting at lower shutter speeds too.  I would need a lot more experimenting time with it to gain absolute control of it's limited capabilities.

But on a larger theme, the reason film looks better (to me that is) is because of the way the light bleeds together to form smoothe color gradients.  Yes, you need better resolution (that of HD some say) to form those gradients without being noticable to the eye...but I don't see that astetic yet.  I don't think they are focused on the color band, just the sharpness.
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Redlum

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« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2005, 01:51:48 PM »
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For future reference I read that the shutter and iris controls issue was some sort of bug where in order to gain total control each function had to be set to manual rather than just being in manual mode.
\"I wanted to make a film for kids, something that would present them with a kind of elementary morality. Because nowadays nobody bothers to tell those kids, \'Hey, this is right and this is wrong\'.\"
  -  George Lucas

Ghostboy

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« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2005, 02:13:02 PM »
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Quote from: ®edlum
I don't know, Ive used one before and don't think its substantially better. Certainly not enough to warrant a rental over the use of a CanonGL2 that I own.


Oh yeah, if you already own a GL2, no point, really, unless you really want 24p. I still use my XL-1 on a nearly daily basis, myself.

MacGuffin

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« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2005, 05:21:40 PM »
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Quote from: Ghostboy
It sounds like you're not planning on buying it, so that's cool, but if you are, keep in mind that it'll be surpassed by the end of the year by far superior, equally affordable models from JVC and Panasonic (and, it's rumored, the XL-3 may take the cake over all of them).


Is the XL-3 supposed to come out at the end of the year too?
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Ghostboy

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« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2005, 05:30:50 PM »
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It's a rumor. Canon reps made vague hints at NAB this year, and the fact that a.) the XL-2 was only a small step up from the XL-1 and b.) they have yet to make an appearance in the HDV race, has created the opinion that they're watching the market and technology, waiting for everyone else to announce their cameras (which they now have) before (hopefully) smearing them all with their own version of the same thing.

Both the Panasonic and JVC cameras will have interchangeable lenses, though, so Canon's going to have to take a big step up in other areas, since that's always been their big pull in the past.

md

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« Reply #13 on: May 11, 2005, 09:09:49 AM »
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in response to editing, if the film is good no one will care what its edited on, theyll be asking how you got such a good performance out of your lead, secondly my friend has the new sony hdv cam...and although its pretty impressive looking I must say it seems like a waste at this point.  Hd hasnt really been standardized yet and he said that he couldnt even import it into fcpHD....but fcp5 should take care of that.  But I'd go with the dvx100a if I were you....or wait till the hvx200 comes out.  

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MacGuffin

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« Reply #14 on: May 11, 2005, 04:41:00 PM »
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Quote from: Ghostboy
It's a rumor. Canon reps made vague hints at NAB this year, and the fact that a.) the XL-2 was only a small step up from the XL-1 and b.) they have yet to make an appearance in the HDV race, has created the opinion that they're watching the market and technology, waiting for everyone else to announce their cameras (which they now have) before (hopefully) smearing them all with their own version of the same thing.

Both the Panasonic and JVC cameras will have interchangeable lenses, though, so Canon's going to have to take a big step up in other areas, since that's always been their big pull in the past.


So, say, one's XL-1 camera was stolen. With the insurance money, should one wait until the XL-3 comes out?
“Don't think about making art, just get it done. Let everyone else decide if it's good or bad, whether they love it or hate it. While they are deciding, make even more art.” - Andy Warhol


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