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What are we reading?

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Raikus

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Reply #150 on: December 16, 2003, 10:23:51 AM


Don't be fooled by the movie. You should read this book if you want a portrayal about the beginning of the Vietnam War. It recounts both the American and North Vietnamese sides during the battles for the Ia Drang Valley. It also does a good job of explaining the foreign policy of the time and what was happening. The most true and accurate portrayal of what war is like that I've read written by the commanding officer and only reporter on the ground.

I was very impressed with it.
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SoNowThen

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Reply #151 on: December 16, 2003, 10:45:09 AM



1984!!!
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

classical gas

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Reply #152 on: December 16, 2003, 03:05:41 PM
sonowthen,
that's one of the best and most important books ever written (in the modern age), in my opinion.  i'm actually loaning my copy to a friend at work today.

SoNowThen

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Reply #153 on: December 16, 2003, 03:36:30 PM
Yeah, it's fucking flooring me.

I was one of few who never read it in high school. I can't believe not ONE of my friends even mentioned how amazing it was. Though I don't think I would've really grasped the subtleties at age 17...


I'm doing a dystopia double dip, with this, and then Brave New World next.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

godardian

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Reply #154 on: December 16, 2003, 03:42:04 PM
Quote from: SoNowThen
Yeah, it's fucking flooring me.

I was one of few who never read it in high school. I can't believe not ONE of my friends even mentioned how amazing it was. Though I don't think I would've really grasped the subtleties at age 17...


I'm doing a dystopia double dip, with this, and then Brave New World next.


Eww... you should do Brave New World first, as it's vastly inferior, and save the best for last. One of the most poorly written "classics" I can think of. Aldous Huxley belongs with J. Fennimore Cooper in the annals of bad writing with mystifying longevity... Really, I think you'll find it the literary equivalent of some bad "message" movie.

Orwell, on the other hand, was quite the writer, quite the thinker (and, surprisingly enough to those who've "reclaimed" him) quite the socialist. Anyone ever seen the 1984 movie?

If you like Orwell, you should try Wyndham Lewis, another politically satirical English novelist (also famous painter). I'm in the middle of his The Revenge for Love right now, and it's pretty funny and pretty sharp.
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"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

SoNowThen

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Reply #155 on: December 16, 2003, 03:43:56 PM
Ah... but the idea of State Control through Pleasure is how I see things, so I'm leaving that one for last.

BTW, don't try to ruin my reading experience by telling me Orwell was a "socialist". Icky.   :wink:
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

myadopteddaughter

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Reply #156 on: December 16, 2003, 03:44:23 PM


I've read this probably a thousand times, but my brain is still disected and thrown back together everytime I read it.
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Sleuth

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Reply #157 on: December 16, 2003, 03:45:01 PM
Quote from: SoNowThen
Ah... but the idea of State Control through Pleasure is how I see things, so I'm leaving that one for last.

BTW, don't try to ruin my reading experience by telling me Orwell was a "socialist". Icky.   :wink:


I thought of bringing it up, but I wanted you to read it first :(
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myadopteddaughter

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Reply #158 on: December 16, 2003, 03:47:52 PM
Umm, how is it possible not to know Orwell was a socialist?
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Sleuth

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Reply #159 on: December 16, 2003, 03:49:05 PM
Quote from: myadopteddaughter
Umm, how is it possible not to know Orwell was a socialist?


Maybe he didn't read the Foreword
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myadopteddaughter

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Reply #160 on: December 16, 2003, 03:51:13 PM
But beyond that, it oozes from every word he writes. Anyway, I am not trying to be an attack bitch, i am just surprised.

Anyway, I liked Animal Farm over 1984.
mmm, mmmm good

Slick Shoes

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Reply #161 on: December 16, 2003, 04:02:30 PM
McSweeney's 12

godardian

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Reply #162 on: December 16, 2003, 04:18:01 PM
Quote from: Slick Shoes
McSweeney's 12


Is that the one that looks like a book, with Joyce Carol Oates in it?

Eggers is able to get an impressive lineup. I love McSweeney's, but I just can't pile that on top of all my New Yorkers I haven't read. So much in-depth, interesting nonfiction and fiction by fine unknowns and some of my favorite authors, and I can't find the time or energy...  :cry:

I wish I had LOTS more time to read. I get in what I can, but... I love to read, and it just requires too much concentration for me to spend hours reading something worthwhile after a tough day at work.
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

Ravi

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Reply #163 on: December 16, 2003, 04:28:15 PM
I just finished Dave Barry Does Japan and Dave Barry's Guide to Guys.

Slick Shoes

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Reply #164 on: December 16, 2003, 04:41:38 PM
Godardian--That was the last one. The new one is a paperback that has twelve stories from twelve unknown writers. Also, a number of "twenty minute" stories, or stories written in in twenty minutes, by some pretty well-known authors, Rick Moody and Jonathan Lethem among them.

One reason I like McSweeney's is because they publish stuff by first-timers who don't have agents or whatever and therefore cannot, would not be able to get published in a more well-known periodical.

I know what you mean, though, about not having enough time to read. You just have to pick and choose. I highly recomend picking up McSweeney's, though. In fact, the one you mentioned -- the one with Joyce Carol Oates, who contributed an awesome story by the way -- comes with a DVD that is pretty entertaining.

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