Author Topic: Bret Easton Ellis  (Read 14816 times)

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children with angels

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #30 on: June 18, 2003, 06:50:26 AM »
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Quote from: cecil b. demented
i half-agree with what you say about RoA though. but i cant help loving every second of it. ellis has said that this is his favorite film based on one of his books so far, and that he actually likes the movie alot.


Huh. That actually surprises me a lot. I guess he gets a kick out of how much everyone responded to it by saying "I hate this movie: everyone in it is just so disgusting!" I guess he digs the trashing of the innocent images of Dawson and that kid from the Wonder Years too. Or maybe I'm just missing something in it. I should watch it again. Like I said, I did enjoy it - but Ellis' writing makes me do more than enjoy, it's something else...
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godardian

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #31 on: June 18, 2003, 10:00:11 AM »
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Quote from: Ghostboy
Quote from: godardian
The ending, particularly, seemed to offer the happiest possible ending for people.


I agree with that -- except for Alfred. His seemed to be the sort of tragic hero of the book, and he gets stuck in a nursing home -- a pretty sorry fate -- leaving Enid to start anew. That solution is what made the otherwise sunny ending seem very cold to me.


I actually didn't see Alfred as the hero, which may have been why it didn't seem nearly so cold to me... He wanted the best for his family, but he wanted it HIS way, and he was a very cold person himself, so... I can't say I felt he really had any more pain than many of the other characters, proportionally. He was the only character coming to the end of his life, which isn't a pretty thing for any of us... and it didn't seem to me that he was dumped in the nursing home by an uncaring family so much as there was no other place for him to go, and they did as much as they could before that. I don't think they (or the author) were taking revenge on this guy with the nursing home thing (though obviously the parents were the conscious or unconscious cause of the "corrections" the children so desperately, despondently, and sometimes humorously inflict on themselves to escape their pasts).


Sorry to turn your Ellis thread into a Franzen one, children! It just came up!
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

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children with angels

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #32 on: June 18, 2003, 10:13:48 AM »
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Quote from: godardian
Sorry to turn your Ellis thread into a Franzen one, children!


That's okay. I'll agree to forgive you if you agree to read Glamorama... :wink:
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godardian

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #33 on: June 18, 2003, 10:16:07 AM »
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Quote from: children with angels
Quote from: godardian
Sorry to turn your Ellis thread into a Franzen one, children!


That's okay. I'll agree to forgive you if you agree to read Glamorama... :wink:


I'll try. Would you say that's the next one I should read, having only read Less than Zero??
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

children with angels

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #34 on: June 18, 2003, 10:25:12 AM »
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Quote from: godardian
I'll try. Would you say that's the next one I should read, having only read Less than Zero??


Well, it would be quite a jump from his first to his last I suppose. But I don't think it would spoil your enjoyment of any others you might want to read later. Although his books do share overlapping characters, it's not done in a linear way that affects your view of the narrative of their lives or anything (that stuff is actaully relatively unimportant, in my opinon).

It's just it's his best, I think, and it'll give you a good idea of why I think he's a writer who's worth reading. If, after that, you wanted to read more, you'd have already had a pretty all-encompassing crash course in his concerns and style, and could appreciate them fully in his earlier books.
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Ghostboy

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #35 on: June 18, 2003, 11:16:04 AM »
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One last regression to Franzen: I shouldn't have said tragic hero. He is the most tragic character, I thought, but he's not a hero. But anyway, I loved the book, and even if I didn't tear up at the end, I did at the point where Enid has to pin the Baby Jesus on the calendar herself. Beautiful stuff.

And now back to Mr. Ellis, who I didn't know was first published at the age of 23. That makes me jealous.

godardian

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #36 on: June 18, 2003, 11:37:02 AM »
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Quote from: Ghostboy
One last regression to Franzen: I shouldn't have said tragic hero. He is the most tragic character, I thought, but he's not a hero. But anyway, I loved the book, and even if I didn't tear up at the end, I did at the point where Enid has to pin the Baby Jesus on the calendar herself. Beautiful stuff.

And now back to Mr. Ellis, who I didn't know was first published at the age of 23. That makes me jealous.


I'm always jealous of prodigies... I have to try hard not to think about the fact that PTA had already made 2 films by the time he was my age.  :(  And Ellis at 23... well, that's just wrong, even if Less Than Zero is easy to spot as the work of a twentysomething (and I don't mean that pejoratively).
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

Pubrick

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #37 on: June 18, 2003, 11:46:09 AM »
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why do i keep clicking on this thread, i hav no interest in it and i think every new post will have spoilers for the books i havn't read and i just can't STOP----CLICKING!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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children with angels

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #38 on: June 18, 2003, 02:26:39 PM »
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Quote from: Ghostboy
Mr. Ellis, who I didn't know was first published at the age of 23. That makes me jealous.


Well, prepare to be even more jealous: that was his second book. His first one was published when he was 21! He was still in college when they made it into a movie. I know: sickening really...

Quote from: P
why do i keep clicking on this thread, i hav no interest in it and i think every new post will have spoilers for the books i havn't read and i just can't STOP----CLICKING!!!!!!!!!!!!!


 :lol:  Odd...
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RazorbladeKid

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #39 on: August 06, 2003, 01:20:06 PM »
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I'm sorry for jumping right into your thread here, but I've been looking up information on Ellis and I came across this site.  I only started reading Ellis last year, but I read all of his books as soon as I read the first one.  Glamorama was the first book I read by him, and by far my favorite.  I would recommend this book to anyone who hasn't read it yet, it is phenomenal.  I was wondering if anyone knew any way to get anything autographed by Mr. Ellis, or where to purchase these items.  I would love to get something like that for the man who initially introduced me to this great author.
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jokerspath

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #40 on: August 06, 2003, 02:06:04 PM »
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I wouldn't know off hand about autographs and such, but its funny this thread resurfaced.  I started Glamorama yesterday and I am planning to watch Rules Of Attraction tonite.  Good times...

aw
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Mesh

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #41 on: August 06, 2003, 03:00:48 PM »
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Quote from: children with angels
Well, prepare to be even more jealous: that was his second book. His first one was published when he was 21! He was still in college when they made it into a movie. I know: sickening really...


I don't care how young Ellis was when he wrote it, Less Than Zero did less than nothing for me.  I couldn't understand why I was reading about such one-dimensional, pathetic, annoying poeple.  I suppose Ellis was going for just that: a portrait of how pathetic, one-dimensional, and annoying those times and people were....but others who write in that general way do it with so much more depth and resonance (DeLillo and Franzen are two excellent examples, btw).

On the contrary, I thought American Psycho (the film, did not read the novel) really had its moments.  I'd rewatch it.

BTW, Ghostboy and godardian are right: The Corrections has no "hero."  In fact, it'd be non-sensical for it to have one.  Like Magnolia, The Corrections is about how every family/individual/group is flawed and how individuals within those groups compensate for the flaws fostered upon them by those around them.

Also, I'd describe Alfred as tragi-comic.  His deterioration is both terrible in its certainty and funny in that his outlook on his own demise is so matter-of-fact.  He's such a fully drawn character...the most realistic of the book's people.

One last thing: putting a loved one in a nursing home is always a blessing and curse for those who opt to do so.  I know first-hand.  When a person deteriorates, those left behind feel obliged to go on with life; similarly, they often feel that's what the person they've left to the care of others would have wanted.  From Alfred's perspective, it may be a prison sentence...but it's a sentence that serves to release his family from what he was and has become.

RazorbladeKid

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #42 on: August 07, 2003, 01:39:16 PM »
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Quote from: jokerspath
 I started Glamorama yesterday and I am planning to watch Rules Of Attraction tonite.  Good times...

aw


I actually just watched RoA this weekend, after reading it quite some time ago.  I really did enjoy the movie, especially Victor's European trip.  There was no way that the relationships in the book explored as deeply as in the book, but it was still enjoyable.  I still hold strong and fast to Glamorama as my favorite book however, it was riveted after reading it.  By the way, has anyone read The Informers?  If so, what did you think of it?
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Dirk

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #43 on: August 07, 2003, 02:37:25 PM »
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Quote from: RazorbladeKid
By the way, has anyone read The Informers?  If so, what did you think of it?


I'm reading it right now actually. Very good read, probably one of my faves from him with American Psycho. Highly recommended  :yabbse-thumbup:
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RazorbladeKid

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Re: Bret Easton Ellis
« Reply #44 on: August 12, 2003, 04:26:59 PM »
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Wow, I'll have to admit, I'm quite surprised that The Informers would be anyone's favorite (or almost favorite) Ellis novel.  I believe it could be my least favorite out of all of his books.  Right now I'm re-reading Less Than Zero, and I was planning on going back to Glamorama next, but I guess maybe I'll give The Informers another try.  I already know Glamorama is my favorite, so I guess I can hold off on reading that one again.  As for right now I'm going to look into some of the authors that have been spoken of recently.  Any suggestions on where to start?
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