Author Topic: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!  (Read 36862 times)

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Drenk

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #180 on: February 03, 2018, 12:01:49 PM »
+1
Yes. She's different because of how she is in the movie and how, ultimately, she manages to make his life better for him. (By poisoning him and making him realize that he should just calm the fuck down sometimes.) The first woman asks for his attention. Can't manage to have it. Alma takes it. Doesn't care. She's fierce.

It makes me think of a movie like The Big Sick (spoilers The Big Sicks) where The One is just a girl he randomly has sex with the same way he randomly has sex with a girl later on in the movie and then she's in a coma and..that's all...What a great girl and chemistry and understanding they have of each other! (The Big Sick is bad.)
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wilberfan

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #181 on: February 03, 2018, 11:27:17 PM »
+1
During my first viewing of Thread, in a film full of standout moments, one that really grabbed me was the character of Barbara Rose and her performance by Harriet Sansom Harris.  I think it's a shame that she hasn't gotten more attention, frankly.  (Understandable, though, I guess, given the two (three) leads.)

Apparently the character was based on an actual person.

Here's my attempt to remind the world (well, our microscopic corner of it) of this woman and her performance in this film.

The Strange, True Story Behind One Of The Saddest ‘Phantom Thread’ Characters

https://nylon.com/articles/phantom-thread-harriet-sansom-harris-barbara-rose-barbara-hutton

Quote
Lesley Manville is superlative in Phantom Thread as Woodcock’s forbiddingly controlled sister Cyril, and more than worthy of attention for supporting actress awards.  But Harris is just as worthy in her own much shorter screen time, and her memorable performance as Barbara Rose is an example of that hopeful adage: “There are no small parts only small actors.”
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Riley Jonathawinn Drake

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #182 on: February 04, 2018, 06:23:16 PM »
0
I recently watched the first trailer again after watching the movie twice, and I noticed that there are a lot of scenes and lines in the trailer that didn't make it in the final cut.

So what do you guys think about those deleted scenes and do you think we will get a short film similar to back beyond concerning all the unused material ? 

csage97

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #183 on: February 04, 2018, 09:54:52 PM »
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I recently watched the first trailer again after watching the movie twice, and I noticed that there are a lot of scenes and lines in the trailer that didn't make it in the final cut.

So what do you guys think about those deleted scenes and do you think we will get a short film similar to back beyond concerning all the unused material ?

Probably on the "Special Edition" Blu-ray a couple of years from now?

There are a bunch of unofficial photos of the production filming in Robin Hood's Bay, and it seems they filmed a bunch of stuff left out of the movie, including stuff at a cemetery (some of these made it into the trailer), Daniel walking outside by a hedge, and some other things. And then there are the scenes that they shot but dropped from the final cut, including the meeting at the church. I'm really hoping these do get included in the regular or special edition blu-ray!

I also noticed that my favourite song from the soundtrack, Sandalwood, wasn't in the movie (it was used for one of the sneak preview scenes when Alma and Reynolds are driving through urban London). I wonder if they used it for deleted scenes.

d

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #184 on: February 05, 2018, 06:15:35 AM »
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The one with Alma on steps seen in that early video from the set in Robin Hoods Bay is also missing from the final cut, isn't it? I wonder what it is about as it looks unlike anything we see in the movie plot-wise.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Y0DtxSWjWg

Since PTA mentioned the audio commentary during AMA, I am curious what kind of extras we will get on bluray. Chryskylodon Blues was cool but I would love to see some more "standard" behind-the-scenes for PT.

Sleepless

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #185 on: February 05, 2018, 09:09:42 AM »
+1
For the most part we're just given the cruelest bits of their relationship (an entirely different sort of passion), but never really allowed to root for them as a couple in the traditional sense. It's a really interesting choice, withholding the part of the story that would satisfy an audience. It's an easy mark so PTA just skips it.

It's been a couple of weeks since I've seen it. Hoping to see it again soon. But I've needed some time to let my thoughts percolate. It's a beautiful film. I'm looking forward to watching it more and discovering new things. I've scanned through this thread, but haven't read everything, so apologies. My initial thought at this point is that its an exploration of what love is, as much as anything else. And love has a lot of different aspects and angles. A big part of the ending, for me, was that Reynolds wants to feel the motherly love he has missed - that's why he wants to eat the mushrooms and get sick. Because that allows Alma to give him that kind of love. She can give him all the types of love that he craves, and he does the same for her. Going back to Modage's comment above, I think this ties into the idea of the phantom thread - the hidden pieces inside the garments. Any love story has many sides to it, many things that happen behind closed doors that only those involved know about. You might imagine these two people who have beautiful clothes at the center of their lives have a romance which is equally beautiful. I'm sure they do, but that's just a part of it. And what PTA does choose to show us is just a part of it too. This isn't a case of ironic "oh, yes they have beautiful things in their lives, but their lives are actually really ugly," rather, we only see those parts of it. We only see the chasteness, this side of things. We know there's other stuff that happens. Reynolds pull Alma into his room, and then shuts the door, shutting us out. They go on their honeymoon, but all we see is his irritation at breakfast. It's a selective portrait of this very real, multifaceted relationship, but with the conscious choice made to only include the "ugly" side of things. But the phantom pieces of the relationship are felt loud and clear. It makes it seem like their relationship is far more fucked up than it actually is. It's basically saying that you might think you know these people and the kind of relationship they'd have, but - surprise - it's actually something entirely different, and - surprise - there's actually a whole lot more to it than that too. Like, we're all trying to figure out how this relationship works - who has the upper hand and when, who pushes whom, what exactly are the dynamics - but we're not shown all of the pieces. Love is a beautiful mystery, and unless you're one of the two people in that relationship, you're never going to have all of the pieces.

Riley Jonathawinn Drake

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #186 on: February 05, 2018, 09:14:13 AM »
0
The one with Alma on steps seen in that early video from the set in Robin Hoods Bay is also missing from the final cut, isn't it? I wonder what it is about as it looks unlike anything we see in the movie plot-wise.

Hmm I also don't remember that this scene was in the film.

Drenk

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #187 on: February 05, 2018, 09:57:19 AM »
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They shot Alma in her little appartment, praying in a church, with her boyfriend (what's in the video with her waiting on the steps), with her brother. It's actually her sister in the scene at the dinner after the wedding.

They thought it would be better if she appeared in Reynold's world.
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Lewton

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #188 on: February 05, 2018, 02:14:40 PM »
+3
Glad to report that I finally saw Phantom Thread! It definitely made a tremendous first impression -- a romantic and weird and melancholic experience that's majorly surprising both in the context of the film and PTA's overall career. I'm very eager to revisit it. I think I'm going to let it linger for a bit before reading through the thread.

This one features a few moments that are now my absolute favourites from any PTA movie (I mean, not just among my favourites, but actually right at the top of the list).

This isn't necessarily one of those moments, but I'll give a quick nod to the shot of Woodcock blindsided by an empty house and staring up at Alma with this uncomprehending expression. I love how confidently and nimbly the movie sort of switched aesthetic gears there. The desired result had to be to get as unflattering and vulnerable a shot of Day-Lewis as possible. Everything clicked into place in that respect: the lighting, that low camera angle, the acting. Search through that shot and look at Day-Lewis' face throughout; there is not one insincere performative molecule in the whole frame. It's a stunning moment where it's really easy to feel for this character. You can sense the sadness of a life that's been about aggressively sheltering himself into work and routine, and it's gotten to the point that an empty house now fills him with fear. The strangeness and sadness of that experience is so well-communicated.

It's not just DDL, of course. Everyone in this movie seems totally attuned to the script's wavelength. Krieps and Manville exude so much energy in different ways and contribute so much to the mood of the movie. The only other Manville film I had previously seen was Another Year, in which she gives one of my favourite performances from any movie. Her great performance as Cyril is just a totally different achievement, which says a lot. Having both of those very distinct performances secured in my memories just further accentuates her mastery. She's an absurdly good actor.

Much of the film's success rests on Krieps. The varied range of glances she sends out throughout the movie are an indispensable part of the overall magic. Her performance is so full of interest -- just so magnetic and fascinatingly elusive. It's great that DDL and PTA didn't really overcrowd the film with their own energy and that Alma/Krieps was given the opportunity to actually flourish and take the reigns of the screen and the story. On a related note, Alma's dressing down of Woodcock at the table is one of the more cathartic bits in a PTA movie in a long time because, at that point, I imagine many audience members would be growing somewhat weary of Woodcock's manner and the claustrophobia of his life, and then Krieps and PTA offer us this amazing release valve through Alma's eruption.

Drenk

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #189 on: February 05, 2018, 07:13:30 PM »
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For those who have the script: before they begin to improv, how close is the asparagus scene to the script? And what's in the script that they don't say?
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wilder

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #190 on: February 05, 2018, 07:32:58 PM »
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Drenk

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #191 on: February 05, 2018, 08:54:02 PM »
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Thanks for that! I think they did improv in the middle then came back to the script. I don't remember Alma talking that much about the curse, which is a good thing since she doesn't need to, and I like that she's angry enough that she ditches the nice things she'd like to tell him.

Or she does talk about the curse and I forgot because it was intense.
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eward

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #192 on: February 05, 2018, 10:00:48 PM »
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I don’t recall any “curse” talk during that scene, nor the “maybe we don’t go together”, etc. Good cuts.
"Do you laugh at jealousy?"

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Lewton

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #193 on: February 06, 2018, 11:50:16 AM »
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During my first viewing of Thread, in a film full of standout moments, one that really grabbed me was the character of Barbara Rose and her performance by Harriet Sansom Harris.

This character has been on my mind a lot, so I searched "Barbara Rose" in this thread to see if anyone else mentioned her (I probably missed some posts that didn't identify her by name). Harriet Sansom Harris -- who played Frasier's agent, Bebe, on Frasier -- is just so great here. I love that there is now a thread linking Frasier and PTA's work. I wonder if he's a fan? Anyway, I bet so many others have already said this, but I really feel like there is a whole movie in that subplot...

On another note...has anyone else noticed that there's kind of a home invasion theme running through the last few films? Woodcock and Alma showing up at Barbara Rose's door reminded me of Freddie appearing at John More's (Christopher Evan Welch) apartment in The Master. It also sort of recalls Plainview brutally threatening H.M. Tilford (David Warshofsky): "one night, I'm gonna' come to you, inside of your house, wherever you're sleeping and I'm going to cut your throat." You can also include Bigfoot bursting through Doc's door near the end of Inherent Vice. I can't remember if Pynchon came up with that bit in the book or if PTA created it?

eward

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Re: Phantom Thread - SPOILERS!
« Reply #194 on: February 06, 2018, 11:59:35 AM »
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You can also include Bigfoot bursting through Doc's door near the end of Inherent Vice. I can't remember if Pynchon came up with that bit in the book or if PTA created it?

That scene's a PTA original.
"Do you laugh at jealousy?"

"No, I don't even laugh at seasickness! I happen to regard jealousy as the seasickness of passion."

 

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