Author Topic: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi  (Read 6294 times)

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Lottery

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #30 on: December 17, 2017, 01:35:44 AM »
0
I instantly fell for The Force Awakens. But The Last Jedi is growing on me minute by minute. Sure it's a bit cheeseball, and some things are a bit spelled-out, but that's Star Wars. This is the best-made, most visually poetic, most subversive, most thematically mature film in the entire franchise.

I liked some of the developments that occurred in the film, some of them were real gutsy but as a whole, this movie remained largely unsatisfying.
Personally, I can't say that this a particularly well made movie. I went back and had quick skim through the original trilogy just to check if they were as well-crafted as I remember them to be and they really are. Well-paced, well-structured, clean compositions an appropriate dose of humour. But this one- horrendous pacing, an abundance of jarring lame jokes, a total mixed bag of visuals amongst a few other disappointing things. All the new films have their issues but this one might be the weakest in terms of craftsmanship. In regard to consistency at least.
I can appreciate thematic strength and maturity, subversive plot elements and all that good stuff but the filmmaking was not at a level which made those things particularly enjoyable.

I maintain that AoTC is the only truly, truly bad SW film but this one is certainly one of the lesser stories. While the quality of the prequel trilogy is questionable, I reckon it's going to end up as a far more memorable experience than this generation's set of SW films.

EDIT:

Perhaps that's a bit harsh (in regard to the craftsmanship). Sometimes the movie works rather well but when it slips up, it slips up really badly making the lack of consistent quality rather alarming/egregious.

Jeremy Blackman

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #31 on: December 17, 2017, 01:47:58 AM »
+1
I probably went too far with ďmost visually poetic,Ē but the experience you describe is completely alien to me.
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wilberfan

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #32 on: December 20, 2017, 05:33:38 PM »
+1
Well, I just got back from seeing this--having gone in with neutral expectations, to be honest.  I'm not a rabid fan, and don't know (and can't remember) all the finer points of various backstories and characters, etc.

But I had a really great time.  Thoroughly enjoyed myself--which, now that I think about it-- is all I really expect from a film like this.  Thrill me, make me laugh, move me a couple of times--we're good. 

So I guess it's just Jeremy and I in the thumbs-up column so far on this one? 

I actually teared-up on at least 4 occasions, which really surprised me.  And possibly my new Favorite Death Scene ever.  I loved the humor and found myself really admiring the casting/performance of Daisy.  None of the performances rang false for me, although Laura Dern's face has some weird angles/proportions to me that I find distracting sometimes.   There was one visual/lack-of-audio moment that made me audibly go "Woah...".

I liked TFA enough to have watched it three times -- and I liked this a lot more.   So this defintely goes in the plus column for me.
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WorldForgot

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #33 on: December 20, 2017, 05:57:14 PM »
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So I guess it's just Jeremy and I in the thumbs-up column so far on this one? 


Personally adored this as an entry in the franchise, particularly appreciate the leaps it takes in piloting the SW Cinematic Universe away from the Skywalkers and closer to an extended universe.

Although, like with the Prequels before 'em. these new SW entries aren't the sort of film that I feel inspired to defend or consider at length. Now... Star Wars video games on the other hand... there we have some ripe discourse material...

Jeremy Blackman

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #34 on: December 22, 2017, 12:11:10 PM »
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No exaggeration, this is the best podcast episode I've listened to all year:


The /Filmcast: Bonus Ep. Ė Star Wars: The Last Jedi Post-mortem

http://www.slashfilm.com/the-filmcast-bonus-ep-star-wars-the-last-jedi-post-mortem/

In this spoiler-filled discussion of The Last Jedi, David, Devindra, and Jeff Cannata are joined by Lindsey Romain to discuss the polarizing reaction to the latest Star Wars film, and to dive into some of the more contentious plot points.
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brockly

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #35 on: December 22, 2017, 06:49:04 PM »
+2
itís been a long time since iíve had any real desire to get my thoughts down for a movie, and it's kind of weird that a movie i donít think is particularly good has really given me the urge to do so. but i find the reactions and discussions surrounding TLJ more fascinating than the movie itself. iíve always had a soft spot for the OG series, and the older i get and the more distant i become from movies i loved growing up, A New Hope and especially Empire have really held up. and in terms of the new films, i like TFA quite a bit and pretty much love Rogue One. both are flawed but i think the reason i responded to one more positively than the other is the same reason i responded rather negatively to TLJ, and thats tone. i don't think every SW film needs to be dark and gritty. iím fine with bad jokes, silliness and cheese but they dial it up to 10 in this movie and whatís worse is these moments donít mesh at all with the plot. i had similar problems during parts of TFA, but not to this extent. a lot of film lovers and intelligent people seem to love this movie, which is great, but iím curious as to why this movie is getting a pass on that front. this to me is more interesting than the film itself.

i donít hate the movie. i think thereís a lot to like and there are a few great moments. i also think Rian is a super talented guy who brought some interesting ideas. iím just baffled by many of the choices he made and how unfocused the film is as a whole.

Jeremy Blackman

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #36 on: December 22, 2017, 07:01:10 PM »
+1
itís been a long time since iíve had any real desire to get my thoughts down for a movie, and it's kind of weird that a movie i donít think is particularly good has really given me the urge to do so. but i find the reactions and discussions surrounding TLJ more fascinating than the movie itself. iíve always had a soft spot for the OG series, and the older i get and the more distant i become from movies i loved growing up, A New Hope and especially Empire have really held up. and in terms of the new films, i like TFA quite a bit and pretty much love Rogue One. both are flawed but i think the reason i responded to one more positively than the other is the same reason i responded rather negatively to TLJ, and thats tone. i don't think every SW film needs to be dark and gritty. iím fine with bad jokes, silliness and cheese but they dial it up to 10 in this movie and whatís worse is these moments donít mesh at all with the plot. i had similar problems during parts of TFA, but not to this extent. a lot of film lovers and intelligent people seem to love this movie, which is great, but iím curious as to why this movie is getting a pass on that front. this to me is more interesting than the film itself.

i donít hate the movie. i think thereís a lot to like and there are a few great moments. i also think Rian is a super talented guy who brought some interesting ideas. iím just baffled by many of the choices he made and how unfocused the film is as a whole.

(SPOILERS)

The sense of humor argument I think is the weakest one leveled against this movie. The Last Jedi has funny moments and scenes sprinkled throughout, but they serve as a reprieve from the brooding and the continuous loss of life. A New Hope, though, has goofiness running through its veins.

It's interesting that so many Rogue One fans seem to dislike The Last Jedi. (I thought Rogue One was really terrible for at least the first hour, and my estimation of the movie continues to deteriorate.) If I were to guess, I think it's that The Last Jedi favors character moments above all else, while Rogue One is concerned with tone and plot and skips a lot of characterization.
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wilberfan

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #37 on: December 22, 2017, 07:33:59 PM »
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Were fan debates as vociferous as this during each release of the original trilogy, or is this a new phenomenon that began with...Episode I?  I get the sense going forward that every subsequent Star Wars film will please some and piss-off others.  (Or is that part of the fun of being a fan?)
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brockly

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #38 on: December 22, 2017, 08:00:41 PM »
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The sense of humor argument I think is the weakest one leveled against this movie. The Last Jedi has funny moments and scenes sprinkled throughout, but they serve as a reprieve from the brooding and the continuous loss of life. A New Hope, though, has goofiness running through its veins.

A New Hope is goofy for sure, and i think that movie is kind of a miracle to be as good as it is, so maybe i overlook much of the goofiness for that reason. but TLJ is in a whole other galaxy of goof.

It's interesting that so many Rogue One fans seem to dislike The Last Jedi. (I thought Rogue One was really terrible for at least the first hour, and my estimation of the movie continues to deteriorate.) If I were to guess, I think it's that The Last Jedi favors character moments above all else, while Rogue One is concerned with tone and plot and skips a lot of characterization.

i know forgettable characters are the biggest problem people have with Rogue One, and i agree its a big problem. i still feel the movie as a whole is more focused than TFA and TLJ. and i'd like to reiterate: my feelings about TLJ are frustrating because i really like individual moments and ideas.

Alexandro

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #39 on: December 28, 2017, 11:38:05 PM »
+4
I don't know, people. I thought it could be about 15 minutes shorter, maybe 20. But other than that I quite enjoyed the ride and was moved by a lot of small and big things. I actually liked how BIG and ample in scope the Rey/Luke/Ren stuff is (in terms of cosmic questionings and soul searching) in contrast to the almost laughable "baby steps" mission Finn and all the others seem to be involved. It's like a massive "what's my place in the universe?/me and the sea and the sky" meditation, going back and forth with matters of such inmediate urgency that feel like looking at little problems with big consequences under a miscroscope. I actually laughed out loud when they started to narrate their plan and then had to repeat it because it was just bananas they even tried it in the first place.

I think the theme of new vs. old is what will define the trilogy and in this film they found ways to make it integral in every storyline and it's clever how that puts us in an ambivalent POV. So even if it's all done in this cheesy b movie language there are interesting notions and surprises which made me, at least, care for the whole thing.

It's weird how Adam Driver is kind of rocking with this role. Never would have guessed it, but you can sense his feelings of inadequacy and confusion bubbling under the surface at all times.

I appreciated the - yeah I know, but it was surprising - superficial musings on heroism, human costs of battle, the tragedy of idealism as an impossibility, the passing of time as part of the force....

Really, I'm baffled by the negative reaction here and in general. I wish the prequels were this accomplished, and to be honest I'm enjoying these more than the originals.

jenkins

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #40 on: January 06, 2018, 08:10:58 PM »
+3
this is my favorite thing i've read about this movie btw


Drenk

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #41 on: January 06, 2018, 09:07:04 PM »
+2
That's the idea. Except there's no sense of history and The First Order looks like they're cosplaying The Empire. There's nothing neo in that.
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pete

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #42 on: January 12, 2018, 12:46:24 AM »
+2
the defense for this film are some of the most long-winded and hyperbolical goings I have ever seen (or at least since Mother?) - it's like people just can't be honest with themselves. Nobody seemed to enjoy the film as a film but everyone so badly wanted to read into everything it's lacking and grade this film on a curve that no other film has ever benefitted from from the general public.
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Jeremy Blackman

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #43 on: January 25, 2018, 12:22:00 PM »
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Slashfilmcast has a spectacularly good interview with Rian Johnson. They go way back with him, so they're comfortable asking him a lot of questions that most interviewers won't. (You can actually sort of tell which questions he's hearing for the first time.) They even get into the nerdy nitpicks ó and Rian has great answers.

http://www.slashfilm.com/filmcast-ep-451-an-evening-with-rian-johnson-director-of-star-wars-the-last-jedi/

It's actually kind of shocking to hear how much creative independence he had writing the script. Even I assumed it was more of a committee type of thing, but he goes into detail, and it wasn't. Basically it worked like this:

- Rian pitched TLJ as an almost entirely character-based film, and Lucasfilm liked that
- They gave him the Force Awakens script to read
- He got to see Force Awakens dailies
- As he was writing, he elected to stop by Lucasfilm twice a week to walk them through his process, so his decisions would be less shocking to them and they could feel involved

Brilliant, really.

Rian has no involvement in the third one, which is disappointing, but I trust JJ will deliver on the characters he created.
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wilberfan

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Re: Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
« Reply #44 on: February 22, 2018, 01:27:07 AM »
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Fascinating documentary short about the sound design, mixing, editing, foley, etc, for The Last Jedi.  Some of the objects used in the foley recording are particularly interesting.


http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/video/force-sound-creating-sounds-galaxy-53204229
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