Author Topic: The best album I've heard all year....  (Read 9895 times)

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Sleuth

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The best album I've heard all year....
« Reply #45 on: May 08, 2003, 02:07:22 PM »
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I still don't get it.  Are you saying Radiohead is pop music?  You don't like songs over 3 minutes?  That's ridiculous to me
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godardian

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« Reply #46 on: May 08, 2003, 02:31:02 PM »
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What I'm saying is:

To go from making tight (still over the "classic" 3-minute structure of the pop song, but worth it), focused, relatively direct music, as they did earlier on, to these recent third-rate prog-rock dronescapes seems to be something they're doing for themselves out of some sort of "artistic" intention, and it feels like a betrayal- much more so than the recent stuff of Blur, who managed to far remove themselves from their full-fledged catchiness while still retaining some hint of melodic interest. Maybe the members of Radiohead should become abstract painters, where this sort of impulse has led more people to become more fruitful and produce works of more beauty. It just doesn't work for me on record from a rock (god, I hate that word- I shall call it "pop," any creative work that's mass-produced for consumers is pop by my definition) band.

I'm not saying I don't like any song over 3 minutes; there'd just better be a damn good reason. If, in well under 3 minutes, the Beatles can do with "Eleanor Rigby" or The Smiths can do with "Panic" more than Radiohead has managed to babble on about and navel-gaze upon over 3 albums, I think they owe us an explanation. Drugs? Pretension? Self-indulgence? All? None? They take themselves too seriously now, and I think THAT's the reason. Even PJ Harvey can crack a joke every once in a while.

The reason I brought up the Johnny Rotten thing is because if there has be a binary (and there really doesn't, but...) then Sex Pistols vs. Pink Floyd is one I'm happy to take sides in, 'cos they're two quite opposite takes on pop music- what it should be, what it should sound like, what the misconceptions about it are. And if you don't think The Sex Pistols can rightly be called "pop," then I can't have a conversation with you.
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SoNowThen

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« Reply #47 on: May 08, 2003, 02:41:51 PM »
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Fair enough, I like the Pistols, but I don't think they ever did a song that even compares to Pigs On The Wing (or anything from Animals), Wish You Were Here, or Time. But I love long drawn out stuff. That's why I like Led Zep live, and don't really give two shits about the Beatles.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

godardian

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« Reply #48 on: May 08, 2003, 03:00:37 PM »
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The Beatles are very overrated... they're all about "Eleanor Rigby" and the early singles for me. But give me the non-overratable Kinks or The Ronettes (or almost any Spector side, for that matter) over bloated, lumbering Dinosaur Zep any day!

You could never call me a muso, though. I don't care about technical proficiency. I'm more or less post-punk in my views on pop music, and Radiohead seems to have regressed to something very pre-punk; in fact, to the very same thing punk was invented to demolish, or at least shame.

And I'm not against sonic experimentation- I love Sonic Youth and Godspeed You Black Emperor and an assortment of other bands who try to stretch the limits of what a pop song can be. Radiohead just doesn't seem to be doing anything on that level of interest.
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

godardian

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« Reply #49 on: May 08, 2003, 03:07:32 PM »
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I really like your Spielberg quote, by the way.

I guess I'm giving myself away in this thread as someone who enjoys inflammatory, take-no-prisoners quotes like "I Hate Pink Floyd" a little too much...
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

children with angels

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The best album I've heard all year....
« Reply #50 on: May 08, 2003, 03:15:46 PM »
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I agree, Radiohead aren't going for that level of interest: they're still just writing great songs with great melodies which happen to be also more interesting (or, shall we just say, 'unusual') than their previous stuff. I don't think it's fair to compare Radiohead to Sonic Youth or Godspeed You (both of whom I love) - they're not really going for the same thing: Radiohead are just inspired now particularly by the Warp Records scene and are therefore using more electronica... Bottom line is: I still think they are writing wonderful pop songs - and this songwriting has been improving ever since the Bends. If it wasn't I wouldn't buy their records - I'm not interested in listening to something purely because I've never heard anything like it before. They're bringing their knowledge of how to write great tunes to the electronica genre (although I don't think I would actually place them in that category), and producing something original in that way...
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SoNowThen

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« Reply #51 on: May 08, 2003, 03:26:55 PM »
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Quote from: godardian
I really like your Spielberg quote, by the way.

I guess I'm giving myself away in this thread as someone who enjoys inflammatory, take-no-prisoners quotes like "I Hate Pink Floyd" a little too much...


Our very own Cecil is responsible for that brilliance (the quote).


Naw, I love take-no-prisoners stuff, it's just that I happen to like Floyd. But inflammatory quotes are what make the world go round! It's all good.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

godardian

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« Reply #52 on: May 08, 2003, 03:41:06 PM »
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"It's all good" is, in fact, the most inflammatory quote of all. Can you even begin to imagine what Johnny Rotten would make of that??

I forgot to mention a newer release that's one of my favorites of 2003 so far:

Yeah Yeah Yeahs, Fever to Tell.

It's not as great as I'd hoped after the EP, but it's extremely cool nonetheless.
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

SoNowThen

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« Reply #53 on: May 08, 2003, 03:42:32 PM »
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I've heard a lot about them. Can you descibe what their sound is like? As in a "band meets band" kinda example.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

cowboykurtis

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« Reply #54 on: May 08, 2003, 03:45:26 PM »
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Quote from: RegularKarate
I hate the term EMO... short for emotional... real swift... music should always be emotional... what the fuck?

I would never say "I listen to Emo"... I didn't even really know what it was until a year or two ago (and I still couldn't tell you what it was without just saying it's what alternative music calls itself now).... how long has that term been around and who's fucking idea was it?

I also think saying that you hate Emo is kind of unfair to a lot of bands who may be grouped into that category just because a large majority of their fans dress a certain way.


i agree -- im just referring to bands that try to fit into the "emo" scene -- why conciously try to fit into a genaralized populous?
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godardian

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« Reply #55 on: May 08, 2003, 03:52:14 PM »
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They're like White Stripes meets very early Siouxsie Sioux, with a big dash of Lydia Lunch.
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

SHAFTR

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« Reply #56 on: May 08, 2003, 03:56:23 PM »
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I don't think it is fair to say that a pop song cannot be over 3 minutes and still be good.  Or either to generally say that.

Example:  Bohemian Rhapsody

Also...The Beatles are not overrated
and Radiohead shouldn't be criticized for not doing the same thing over and over.  Every one of their albums have been different, but they still command a certain sense of authorship that lets you know it is Radiohead.
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godardian

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« Reply #57 on: May 08, 2003, 04:19:14 PM »
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I actually never did say that. I said (tongue in cheek) that I don't trust them, meaning that a pop song over 3 minutes has more work to do to convince me it's worthwhile. And I certainly don't think Radiohead warrant that much of my time.

Long songs (well over 5 minutes) I love:

"Wickerman" - Pulp

"Marquee Moon" - Television

"Station to Station" - David Bowie

"Land" - Patti Smith

"Jenny Ondioline" - Sterolab
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

SoNowThen

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The best album I've heard all year....
« Reply #58 on: May 08, 2003, 04:22:22 PM »
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Sympathy For The Devil
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

Mesh

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« Reply #59 on: May 14, 2003, 02:08:26 PM »
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Quote from: godardian

2. White Stripes

3. Blur.

4. The Coral.


Elephant is alright.  Not quite as good as the last one, which itself was just alright.

Think Tank has some of Blur's best work and some of its dullest.  A good album overall, but nothing to get that excited about.

The Coral album came out stateside in 2002 and has been out in the UK for  quite a while longer.  It's decent record and an excellent debut.

Some of my favorites from 2003:

Alaska! - Emotions
Calexico - Feast of Wire
Holopaw - Holopaw
Loose Fur - Loose Fur
Stephen Malkmus and the Jicks - Pig Lib (+ bonus disc)

If I had to pick my front runner for album of the year, I'd go with the Malkmus.  For debut album of the year:  Holopaw.
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