Author Topic: lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?  (Read 7474 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

tpfkabi

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 2669
  • Respect: +21
    • twitter deed, twitter dead. in the heart or in the head?
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« on: April 22, 2003, 09:20:48 PM »
0
i caught the tail end of American Graffitti on tv and there was a little making of special after it. i've only seen parts of the film so i can't quite compare.

they were talking about how AG was very experimental in terms of multiple story lines going on simulataneously.

this was made before any of Altman's character vehicles right?

if so, in a way george is an influence on pta then.

not that i'm a big lucas fan, but i do love the original star wars trilogy. i think the fact that those films were so popular, that people over look the experimental nature of those films. also, if you know anything about sound design, lucas walter burch were very experimental with that area as well.

any corrections on time lines, or comments are welcome.
I am Torgo. I take care of the place while the Master is away.

Gold Trumpet

  • The Master of Three Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 5767
  • Respect: +151
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2003, 11:04:12 PM »
0
OK, as always dealing with the topic of Lucas, and especially talk of American Graffitti, there has to be some non important matters first talked about and that is only this:

American Graffitti is Lucas' only good movie.

Now onto the real things spoken about Lucas. AG came out in 1973, 3 years after MASH came out. AG did absolutely nothing though in anything at all in multilayer storytelling or whatever. It was actually seen as a return to a simpler way of telling a story, and that was one set in the 1950s with the cheerfulness and romanticism of sorts brought back into a movie, aka nostalgia. Where MASH is based completely off multilayer interaction that does not seem scripted at all and more off improv acting and improv placement of scenes that had not only a multi layer feeling, but a realism of sorts, AG has small little snippets of improv realism and basically all that serves me from memory is when the dorky kid loses control of his mo ped and crashes into a building while it is just in park. Ah well, after AG, Lucas made Star Wars, which was great in visuals for the time, but imposed on a B style film platter to speak for its "mythological inspiration". Then Lucas became the business man as he stopped directing for the last two movies in the series and acted as overseer and God, and then went back into directing with the new ones but acted even more as businessman while he now promotes digital filmmaking as the great thing when in fact, it is a terrible waste of money that has no effect. Not to be mean, I am really am an asshole starving for blood, but Lucas also personally is the business man of the toilet paper I use so my non essentials can personally meet the most non essential man in the movie business. *middle fingers up*

~rougerum

MrBurgerKing

  • The Magic Flight
  • ****
  • Posts: 636
  • Respect: +23
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2003, 11:13:03 PM »
0
Quote from: The Gold Trumpet
OK, as always dealing with the topic of Lucas, and especially talk of American Graffitti, there has to be some non important matters first talked about and that is only this:

American Graffitti is Lucas' only good movie.

Now onto the real things spoken about Lucas. AG came out in 1973, 3 years after MASH came out. AG did absolutely nothing though in anything at all in multilayer storytelling or whatever. It was actually seen as a return to a simpler way of telling a story, and that was one set in the 1950s with the cheerfulness and romanticism of sorts brought back into a movie, aka nostalgia. Where MASH is based completely off multilayer interaction that does not seem scripted at all and more off improv acting and improv placement of scenes that had not only a multi layer feeling, but a realism of sorts, AG has small little snippets of improv realism and basically all that serves me from memory is when the dorky kid loses control of his mo ped and crashes into a building while it is just in park. Ah well, after AG, Lucas made Star Wars, which was great in visuals for the time, but imposed on a B style film platter to speak for its "mythological inspiration". Then Lucas became the business man as he stopped directing for the last two movies in the series and acted as overseer and God, and then went back into directing with the new ones but acted even more as businessman while he now promotes digital filmmaking as the great thing when in fact, it is a terrible waste of money that has any effect. Not to be mean, I am really am an asshole starving for blood, but Lucas also personally is the business man of the toilet paper I use so my non essentials can personally meet the most non essential man in the movie business. *middle fingers up*

~rougerum


Great post! It's ironic that Mr. Lucas doesn't like Star Wars that much. That's like if Dave Thomas hated Wendys (RIP). It's his life! He better grow to love it.

I'm still sick to my stomach though of that cowboy guy's image that he had earlier.

Duck Sauce

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 1986
  • Respect: +4
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2003, 11:27:08 PM »
0
I loved American Grafitti, and it showed a lot of promise from Lucas, I just want to know where he lost interest in making films and why he felt he was obligate (or wanted to make $$) to make prequels instead of something else. Or what if anything he will do after star wars.

Pwaybloe

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 1216
  • Respect: +31
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2003, 10:18:55 AM »
0
Hold on while I hold my food down, but I have to agree with GT.  

Did anyone like THX-1138?  I thought it was pretty good... had a weird 70's vibe to it.  I think the original Rollerball ripped off a lot of that movie.

tpfkabi

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 2669
  • Respect: +21
    • twitter deed, twitter dead. in the heart or in the head?
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2003, 10:46:39 AM »
0
ok. i haven't seen Mash. i have seen Nashville which came out in 75 i think. i believe i read that lucas will try something non Star Wars after the next one. i don't know why he didn't do something in between the first trilogy and the new one. maybe the fact that he was set for life as far as money goes, is one reason. i guess he worked more on establishing his ranch and stuff. he owns ILM, right? no doubt, they are always on the cutting edge of special effects. he was the catylyst to THX and improved theater sound. i have yet to see THX. he has definitely made some important contributions to the cinema, it's sad to see what he's doing now. he really needs to collaborate on his scripts. the dialogue is horrible. if you have to break the 3 year time span, do it. don't make the film suffer. i admire the fact that he has total control over what he does. the film co's just help with distribution i believe.
I am Torgo. I take care of the place while the Master is away.

Gold Trumpet

  • The Master of Three Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 5767
  • Respect: +151
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2003, 02:01:05 PM »
0
To answer Duck Sauce, Lucas never really had much interest in directing films like American Graffitti at all. The only reason he even directed it because he couldn't find a job to do the stuff he wanted to and his studio, Zentropa Studios, which he was partnered with Coppola, was falling under. Coppola had to be a hired gun for The Godfather and Lucas for American Graffitti just to stay in the business basically because things had gotten so bad. Lucas never really even came from the filmmaker type of background. His background mainly was an expertise in engineering and the technical things attributed to the movies. AG was likely a way for him to get financing to make Star Wars, which is what he really wanted to do and his actions since then has shown what he is mainly interested in doing. Only reason he is directing the new ones is for control reasons, to just gurantee that he has it as he is making films that, in his mind, is pushing technology farther and farther.

~rougerum

SoNowThen

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 4536
  • Respect: +9
    • 24/30 Cinema
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2003, 03:03:45 PM »
0
I wouldn't call Lucas a director-for-hire on AG. It was a pretty personal story. I read in Easy Riders, Raging Bulls (bio book on 70's directors) that Lucas wanted to prove to people that he could make an accessable film, after nobody liked THX. He really put his heart and soul into AG, and that's probably why it's his best movie. Coppola, by the way, had to fight to help get AG released, so it's obvious the whole group really felt strongly about the film.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

Gold Trumpet

  • The Master of Three Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 5767
  • Respect: +151
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2003, 03:20:57 PM »
0
I think you're right SoNowThen, and I am going to concede to you in many ways but keep the point that I do remember American Graffitti was a project Lucas was forced to do in order to keep afloat after his personal sci fi arthouse film, THX, failed. I haven't seen that movie so can't speak on it. But I do remember the project was one Lucas really had to do, and when he did do it, he was, like you say, very committed to making it work to prove he can direct accessable films and such. But I still think his heart belonged mainly to the advancement of technology in the movies because after gaining all the power, he hasn't come 200 miles near a project like AG at all.

~rougerum

SoNowThen

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 4536
  • Respect: +9
    • 24/30 Cinema
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2003, 03:22:45 PM »
0
True true.

Which is a shame, really.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

MacGuffin

  • Admin
  • *****
  • Posts: 22985
  • Respect: +638
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2004, 06:07:24 PM »
0
Lucas to Receive AFI Lifetime Award

After creating "Star Wars," "Raiders of the Lost Ark" and "American Graffiti," Darth Vader might insist it was George Lucas' DESTINY to get the American Film Institute's lifetime achievement award.

Lucas, 60, was picked on Friday to be the recipient of the organization's 33rd annual prize, following such recent recipients as Meryl Streep, Robert De Niro and Tom Hanks.

"I've been very fortunate to have had a long career doing what I love to do, and being recognized by the AFI for it is really an honor," Lucas said. "I'm proud to be counted among such an extraordinary group of people whose lives are dedicated to the art of making movies."
 
Previous honorees include Jack Nicholson, Barbra Streisand, Elizabeth Taylor, Steven Spielberg, Alfred Hitchcock, Sidney Poitier and Orson Welles.

The gala dinner and ceremony, in which clips of his films will be presented by many of the stars he worked with over the years, is set to take place next June in Los Angeles.

The award marks a busy year for Lucas. Last month his original "Star Wars" trilogy debuted for the first time on DVD (and became a best seller) along with a revised version of his first film, the sci-fi dystopian thriller "THX 1138."

Lucas also was one of the key presenters recently at the 75th anniversary celebration for the University of Southern California's School of Cinema-Television (which boasts him as one of its most famous graduates).

And in May, he will wrap up his "Star Wars" prequels with the release of "Episode III Revenge of the Sith," which will reveal how Darth Vader became a scarred, half-human half-machine villain.
“Don't think about making art, just get it done. Let everyone else decide if it's good or bad, whether they love it or hate it. While they are deciding, make even more art.” - Andy Warhol


Skeleton FilmWorks

tpfkabi

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 2669
  • Respect: +21
    • twitter deed, twitter dead. in the heart or in the head?
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2004, 06:24:35 PM »
0
well, they won't have many films to show clips from unless they add ones he produced or wrote the story for.....still, that's not even that many i don't think.
I am Torgo. I take care of the place while the Master is away.

Chest Rockwell

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 1596
  • Respect: 0
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2004, 11:50:48 PM »
0
Yea but they can talk about the ones he did do forever, unlike the 2 minutes they give to others' movies. Star Wars alone could take up an hour.

tpfkabi

  • The Master of Two Worlds
  • *****
  • Posts: 2669
  • Respect: +21
    • twitter deed, twitter dead. in the heart or in the head?
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2004, 10:45:49 AM »
0
quality over quantity.........except when they get to eps 1 & 2:
"after blankity blank years George revisited the Stars Wars universe. he pushed the envelope in the digital realm by filming using only digital cameras..............that's it."
I am Torgo. I take care of the place while the Master is away.

soixante

  • The Magic Flight
  • ****
  • Posts: 649
  • Respect: +5
lucas the father of the altmanesque multi character movie?
« Reply #14 on: October 17, 2004, 12:03:10 PM »
0
For a brief, shining moment in the 70's, Lucas was an auteur.  THX was his despairing vision of the future, and Graffiti was his fond look back at an idealized past.  Graffiti is indeed a highly personal film, as it draws upon Lucas' own experiences growing up in Modesto in the early 60's.

Star Wars combines the technical innovations of THX and the humanistic concerns of Graffiti into a mythological vision of people coexisting with high technology, with virtue triumphing over tyranny.  Art Murphy's original 1977 review in Variety stated it best -- "Lucas doesn't allow the technology to overshadow the human drama."

Once Lucas turned to producing, his films became more effects-driven, and he forgot about the most important element of all -- telling a story.  

I remember when Star Wars first came out, Lucas claimed he would concentrate on smaller films.  He's saying the same thing now.  

As for Altman, his experiments with sound design and multi-character scenarios predate THX by about two years.
Music is your best entertainment value.

 

DMCA & Copyright | Terms & Conditions | Privacy Policy