Author Topic: Michelangelo Antonioni  (Read 16198 times)

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tpfkabi

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Michelangelo Antonioni
« Reply #15 on: April 15, 2003, 08:08:16 PM »
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Quote from: The Gold Trumpet
I hope this helps.

~rougerum


yeah. that helps a lot. does the Criterion commentary go into depth on this? and..how do you like the Criterion disc of the film?

i see mention of the Passion of Joan Arc. i remember Godard and Lang talking about this on the Criterion Contempt. how is this film?
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Gold Trumpet

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« Reply #16 on: April 15, 2003, 10:03:57 PM »
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Criterion disc is great and my detailing of the final scene in L'Avventura I mainly credit from that commentary. Very good one.

And yes, it is an incentive you at least watch The Passion of Joan of Arc once in your life. May not think it is all that great, but you should see what basically made film into an art form to begin with. Silent cinema, especially at its barest of bones like in this movie, is not for all.

~rougerum

tpfkabi

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« Reply #17 on: April 16, 2003, 10:49:33 AM »
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after i thought about it, i remembered seeing a tree moving, but not the other things around it. i took it as being odd, but didn't really give it much thought.

i like silent films. i really like chaplin and Keaton. sunrise was great. i think metropolis was pretty much silent too and it was pretty good, so i'm down with silent films. i'm more of a visual person anyways.
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MacGuffin

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« Reply #18 on: July 09, 2003, 05:31:55 AM »
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"Blow Up" (1966). Antonioni's portrait of '60s swinging London is on Turner's schedule for a DVD release for next year.
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SoNowThen

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« Reply #19 on: July 09, 2003, 09:26:42 AM »
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Quote from: MacGuffin
"Blow Up" (1966). Antonioni's portrait of '60s swinging London is on Turner's schedule for a DVD release for next year.


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Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

chainsmoking insomniac

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« Reply #20 on: July 09, 2003, 09:27:17 AM »
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Woo-hoo!!!!!
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ono

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« Reply #21 on: July 14, 2003, 04:37:42 PM »
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I just got through L'Avventura.  Well, sort of.  My roommate's blasting that awful movie Basic in the background didn't help my movie any.  And well, while there were some (read: one or two) memorable parts, mostly, the film bored the snot out of me.  I'll probably need to see it again, on DVD or something (VHS is really starting to annoy me, but that's mostly what my library has).

Anyway, I generally don't care how "important" a film is, which is what I think GT is getting at when he heaps praise on L'Avventura: that it did a lot for advancing the art of film.  While that's all well and good, "important" films are overrated.  People hail Citizen Kane as "important" because of its advancements in technology and art.  Ditto with D.W. Griffith's Birth of a Nation.  Kane is a decent film, nothing more.  Birth of a Nation is a horrible film, period, and should not get the praise it does just for technical innovations.  Getting there first isn't nearly as important as using a technique well.  So what I want to hear is, importance aside, why is L'Avventura such a good film?  'Cause to me, well, it's simply not (though I do admit I should probably watch it again).  (And GT, if you reply, please indent more often than you normally do.  Paragraphs are your friend.  :))

Gold Trumpet

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« Reply #22 on: July 14, 2003, 07:26:48 PM »
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Quote from: Onomatopoeia
(And GT, if you reply, please indent more often than you normally do.  Paragraphs are your friend.  :))


Fuck that, paragraphs still owe me twenty bucks. I understand what you are saying, but I do think personal love on my part belongs with L'Avventura as much as I also realize its social importance. I partly agree with you on Kane and Birth. I love Kane, but Welles as a filmmaker, I am more prone to watch The Trial and performance wise, I am taking The Third Man. For me, though, with all the details aside to my understanding of it, why I love the movie so much is because it is not only great, but it creates its own world. Its a movie that feels like it is outside of other movies or any language of movies we know and feels like it is its own being.

Satiyat Ray did that with Panther Panchali and recently Songs from the Second Floor did it too. 2001: A Space Odyssey, most definitely.  I hear Yasijuro Ozu is like that at his best. Whatever the film is trying to be, at least these films are their own and and in many ways, I am identifying with the more so now, it is equal personal love for L'Avventura. I hope you watch the movie again under better settings so the movie can bring maybe a better reaction from you.
*Just looked back at his posts on the first page of this thread and only could think, "What the fuck was I thinking posting like that?"*
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tpfkabi

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« Reply #23 on: July 14, 2003, 10:43:44 PM »
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Quote from: Onomatopoeia
Kane is a decent film, nothing more.  <:))


i couldn't disagree more, but i think i gave some of my reasons in the welles thread.

right now i have the first "real" scene of the film in my head. after the fake news reel (where the entire story is set up), the news real ends abruptly and the beams of light and smoke and shadows and people come in........ahh.....isn't that the coolest?
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SoNowThen

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« Reply #24 on: July 15, 2003, 11:13:52 AM »
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Quote from: Onomatopoeia
I just got through L'Avventura.  Well, sort of.  My roommate's blasting that awful movie Basic in the background didn't help my movie any.  And well, while there were some (read: one or two) memorable parts, mostly, the film bored the snot out of me.  I'll probably need to see it again, on DVD or something (VHS is really starting to annoy me, but that's mostly what my library has).

Anyway, I generally don't care how "important" a film is, which is what I think GT is getting at when he heaps praise on L'Avventura: that it did a lot for advancing the art of film.  While that's all well and good, "important" films are overrated.  People hail Citizen Kane as "important" because of its advancements in technology and art.  Ditto with D.W. Griffith's Birth of a Nation.  Kane is a decent film, nothing more.  Birth of a Nation is a horrible film, period, and should not get the praise it does just for technical innovations.  Getting there first isn't nearly as important as using a technique well.  So what I want to hear is, importance aside, why is L'Avventura such a good film?  'Cause to me, well, it's simply not (though I do admit I should probably watch it again).  (And GT, if you reply, please indent more often than you normally do.  Paragraphs are your friend.  :))


Some cool things about L'avventura (and people... please correct me if I am wrong in any facts...):

While it may be slow, Antonioni used this film to invent his narrative structure based around the Fake Plot. That thing that holds us until we are at bursting point with the important characters, then he can forget about plot and just let us simmer with them to the proper point. While we now are much more slaves to constantly progessing (and resolving) narrative, if you don't let that be a factor in judging the film, you can "read" it in the way he wanted, and the disappearance of the girl just works so well. Antonioni continued this in Red Desert with the boy's sickness, and in Blow Up of course with the dead body. I think it's just one other cool way to set up a totally different payoff in your story, and to give you the time needed to build to that payoff.

Also, I believe this was Monica Vitti's first film. She is amazing. Marks just for that fact.

Lastly, the camera work is astounding. If for nothing else, this film is great to watch for the visuals that are beautiful, yet stifling and slightly disturbing (in a calm, dry way), that only Antonioni can do.

Please give it another chance on Criterion.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

SoNowThen

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« Reply #25 on: September 16, 2003, 10:38:59 AM »
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Oi (that was a pretentious post I put awhile back, huh?).

Anyway, I'm doing the Trilogy of Alienation now, just finished re-watching L'Avventura & La Notte last night, will do L'eclisse tonight (for the first time!!).

Um, I was doing some reading, and I came across this fact that I had never noticed before. So I checked it out and sure enough: (in L'avventura) the brunette babe that Sandro sees during the mob of reporters, whose name is Gloria Perkins, is the same girl he sleeps with at the end when Claudia catches him. It was mentioned that Gloria was a "writer", but also that she could be bought for a month's worth of wages. It seems like Sandro got her for pretty cheap. But geez, now a whole lot more of this flick makes sense to me. Too bad I missed it before. Did anybody else make the same mistake I did, thinking they were two unrelated episodes? Only one review or piece of criticism I've read mentions this, all others seem to overlook it...
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

modage

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« Reply #26 on: November 11, 2003, 09:16:57 PM »
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just saw L'Avventura.  it was okay.  a little long.
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SHAFTR

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« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2003, 09:21:37 PM »
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Quote from: themodernage02
just saw L'Avventura.  it was okay.  a little long.


Just wait, give it a day or two to fester.  You'll want to see it again.  I did quite a bit of reading on L'Avventura, along with a 10 or so page paper, and it really is a great film.  There is a certain feeling that the viewer has when the film is finished.  I think it takes awhile for someone to finally realize that feeling.
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classical gas

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« Reply #28 on: November 12, 2003, 05:14:28 AM »
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Quote from: Onomatopoeia
I just got through L'Avventura.  Well, sort of.  My roommate's blasting that awful movie Basic in the background didn't help my movie any.


oh, how similar our lives must be.

classical gas

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« Reply #29 on: November 12, 2003, 05:19:36 AM »
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Quote from: SHAFTR
Quote from: themodernage02
just saw L'Avventura.  it was okay.  a little long.


Just wait, give it a day or two to fester.  You'll want to see it again.  I did quite a bit of reading on L'Avventura, along with a 10 or so page paper, and it really is a great film.  There is a certain feeling that the viewer has when the film is finished.  I think it takes awhile for someone to finally realize that feeling.


agreed

 

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