Xixax Film Forum

The Director's Chair => The Director's Chair => Topic started by: SoNowThen on October 01, 2003, 11:57:42 AM

Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 01, 2003, 11:57:42 AM
What a fuckin' master. I've now seen Before The Revolution, The Conformist, and pieces of Partner and Last Tango In Paris. He's got a new one coming out in the fall.

Paul Schrader said of him: "it's like he put Godard and Antonioni in bed together, held a gun to their heads, and said 'you two guys fuck, or I'll shoot you'." That's some high praise.

Let's talk about this demigod of cinema...
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: meatwad on October 01, 2003, 01:02:47 PM
just saw The Conformist a few days ago. Beautiful film. They need to have a dvd release of it
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 01, 2003, 01:09:10 PM
Yeah, we need to organize one of those online petitions to get this on disc. Did you see it with the english dub? I'm usually against that sort of thing, but I find the unmatching voices really lent something to the movie. Made it more eery or something, I dunno. I really hope that when the disc does come out they have an option for both original Italian and english dub.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: soixante on October 01, 2003, 01:09:52 PM
Bertolucci is great.  He has a new film coming out either this year or early next year, set in 1968.

Last Tango in Paris is a masterpiece.  That film, along with The Conformist, has influenced many American filmmakers.  Bertolucci's cinematographer, Vittorio Storaro, has been hired by American directors like Coppola and Warren Beatty.  Apocalypse Now owes a lot of its distinct look to Storaro, as does Reds.

1900 is a cool film that should be put on DVD.  I haven't seen Luna, which barely got released back in 1979.  Stealing Beauty was pretty good.

Bertolucci is one of the greats.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: ono on October 01, 2003, 03:19:31 PM
Last Tango is great, if a little misguided at the end, and meandering in the middle.  But still, it's one of those films that once you see, you'll never forget.  So yeah, for that alone, Bertolucci gets :yabbse-thumbup:  I SO want to see The Last Emperor and 1900 (in its original uncut state on DVD whenever it eventually, hopefully comes out).
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: Alethia on October 01, 2003, 04:44:27 PM
ive only seen last tango and i loved it.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 03, 2003, 09:54:34 AM
So I watched Partner last night. I'll be honest, I didn't understand 80% of it. Like some Godard, you have to go out and read the 10 books the director is referencing, and see the 20 films he's paying homage to. So it's not that I disliked the movie, but I'll need to put another 20 or 30 hours into reference material, then watch it again. Oh well...

-------------------

Bertolucci's new film is called The Dreamers, and is set in Paris in '68. Sounds pretty interesting. A dramatic time and place, anyway...
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: godardian on October 03, 2003, 11:05:28 AM
Great Bertolucci: The Conformist and Before the Revolution.

Good Bertolucci: The Last Emporor, Besieged.

Culturally important but vastly, vastly overrated Bertolucci: Last Tango in Paris. Same category as I Am Curious... and The Night Porter. Breaking taboos, but dragged down by being so focused on that. Some beautiful moviemaking in those, but all are dated at best.

I haven't seen 1900 or Stealing Beauty. Or Little Buddha. I'm a Bertolucci "fan," but not die-hard. I need to complete my exposure to his body of work, though.

Apparently, the MPAA is butchering his new movie...? Anyone hear anything about that?
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: MacGuffin on October 03, 2003, 11:10:55 AM
"The Dreamers"

Release Date: March 19th, 2004 (LA/NY); expands to other cities at later dates

Release Date Note: Fox Searchlight was originally aiming for a platform release starting on October 3rd, 2003, but they have decided to hold it back five months until March 19th, 2004. The primary reason for the move is to allow Bertolucci time to make drastic cuts to the film, because of concern that the amount of sex and nudity in the European version would make it impossible for this movie to get anything but an NC-17 in the U.S. (Fox Searchlight wants an R).

Cast: Michael Pitt (Matthew), Louis Garrel (Theo), Eva Green (Isabelle), Jean-Pierre Kalfon (himself), Jean-Pierre Leaud (himself).

Based Upon: The novel, "The Holy Innocents", by Gilbert Adair, who also wrote the screenplay. Another film based upon a novel by Gilbert Adair was 1997's Love and Death on Long Island.

Premise: An American college student, Matthew (Pitt), pursuing his education abroad in Paris in 1968 becomes friends with a French brother, Guillaume (Garrel), and sister, Danielle (Green), through a shared love of the cinema, while the May, 1968 Paris student riots (which eventually shut down most of the French government) are happening in the background.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 03, 2003, 11:16:24 AM
Why is it that porn is the biggest growing business in North America, all over everywhere, and yet we have to insist on tampering with works of masters like Kubrick and Bertolucci. Why? Because a 17 year old might sneak in to this movie made for adults? As if anybody under 18 even knows about this movie. And if they do, chances are they're pretty damn more mature than your average college crowd. Let the man make the film he wants to make for fucks sakes. Aaaaarrrghhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sorry, ranting...

Anyway, I agree on the Best Bertolucci column. They need to put more of him on dvd.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: Gold Trumpet on October 03, 2003, 11:19:23 AM
Quote from: godardianApparently, the MPAA is butchering his new movie...? Anyone hear anything about that?

Yes, Yes I have.

Bertolucci Says Fox Wants To "Mutilate" His Film

Italian director Bernardo Bertolucci, who received critical acclaim following the screening of his latest film The Dreamers at the Venice Film Festival on Sunday, angrily accused 20th Century Fox Monday of demanding that cuts be made in the film that, he said, would leave it "amputated and mutilated." The film includes frontal nudity and explicit sex scenes that involve teenage college students. As reported in today's (Tuesday) Los Angeles Times, Bertolucci suggested that a rift between the studio and its art-house subsidiary Fox Searchlight may have occurred over the film. Bertolucci said that when he originally delivered the film to Fox Searchlight, "They were enthusiastic and began preparing trailers. Then in July something odd happened, like lightning out of the blue. They told [me and producer Jeremy Thomas] that Fox could not release the film as it was." Representatives of the companies did not attend the press conference and were not available for comment.

This sucks because some compromises likely will happen and we won't see Bertolucci's full version for a while.

~rougerum
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 03, 2003, 11:23:34 AM
Quote from: MacGuffinThe primary reason for the move is to allow Bertolucci time to make drastic cuts to the film, because of concern that the amount of sex and nudity in the European version would make it impossible for this movie to get anything but an NC-17 in the U.S. (Fox Searchlight wants an R).

Ah man, stupid Bertolucci. Doesn't he realize that by having the NC-17 rating he can't cash in on all the kids that parents over 17 are gonna bring to the R rated version? What an idiot.

Fuck. For serious. In a movie of this nature, what is the thinking behind this butchery? Are they really gonna make that much more with an R rating, in an American release of a European director's non-English film?
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: godardian on October 03, 2003, 11:49:04 AM
Quote from: SoNowThenWhy is it that porn is the biggest growing business in North America, all over everywhere, and yet we have to insist on tampering with works of masters like Kubrick and Bertolucci. Why?

I'd say the two things have very much to do with each other, the return of the repressed and so on... I ambivalently like porn, but I think its hugeness as a business is due to the lack of open scrutiny and discussion of sex, which would lead to more "real," flawed, person-to-person sex rather than endless, unrealistic masturbation fantasies. Much of what passes in our culture for sexual openness is nothing but a manifestation of (reaction to) repression.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 03, 2003, 12:06:45 PM
But see, what I'm saying is that I don't think it's a repression problem, but a marketing one. The ratings board doesn't stop films from being made (directly, anyway), it just applies its rating (which I will admit is 99% bullshit most of the time). But why won't Fox Searchlight just figure out a marketing strategy for NC-17 of this movie? Wasn't it done with a film in the last couple years, and they did alright with NC-17? Just try and make this work as an adult film. Because, I mean, cutting nudity aside, is this really gonna be a mainstream America "R" release? Why not sell it as Adult European counter-programming? Is there not any chance at all to turn profit with NC-17? Can all these marketing whiz kids not find an answer?
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: godardian on October 03, 2003, 12:23:17 PM
Quote from: SoNowThenBut see, what I'm saying is that I don't think it's a repression problem, but a marketing one. The ratings board doesn't stop films from being made (directly, anyway), it just applies its rating (which I will admit is 99% bullshit most of the time). But why won't Fox Searchlight just figure out a marketing strategy for NC-17 of this movie? Wasn't it done with a film in the last couple years, and they did alright with NC-17? Just try and make this work as an adult film. Because, I mean, cutting nudity aside, is this really gonna be a mainstream America "R" release? Why not sell it as Adult European counter-programming? Is there not any chance at all to turn profit with NC-17? Can all these marketing whiz kids not find an answer?

Ah, but it IS a problem with repression, with the MPAA represnting the "standards" of the "people" and acting as the agent of repression. Because of the same "standards" and "people," the business arm of Fox Searchlight will not allow an NC-17 rating. I don't know if this is true for Bertolucci, but many filmmakers must agree to an R rating in their contract, and if they don't get one, the distributor is not obligated to release their film.

They way they see it, any film that did "alright" with an NC-17 would absolutely and inarguably have done better with an R.

I say abolish the whole bullshit rating system.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: MacGuffin on October 03, 2003, 12:31:00 PM
Quote from: SoNowThenIs there not any chance at all to turn profit with NC-17? Can all these marketing whiz kids not find an answer?

The large majority of theaters (art house ones too) will not book and show an NC-17 rated film and most newspapers will not advertise it either. So, yes, you can put some blame of the MPAA, but theaters share some of that blame too. The MPAA was trying to make things right by making X and NC-17 an adults only rating, but that label has always associated it with porn, even though violence might be the reason. If Fox Searchlight was truly supportive they would release it Unrated.

Also, the porn relation has to do between the difference of public theaters (privately owned) and what you do in your own home.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 03, 2003, 12:35:42 PM
could they release it unrated? And what would that mean (in terms of advertising, where it can show, etc)?
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: MacGuffin on October 03, 2003, 12:44:26 PM
Quote from: SoNowThencould they release it unrated? And what would that mean (in terms of advertising, where it can show, etc)?

Unrated is more widely accepted. Some theaters will not book it since it hasn't gone through the MPAA, but it's up to the theaters to decide for themselves. Newspapers will advertise it too.

Here's more:
http://www.mindspring.com/~krypto/nyp070101.html
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 03, 2003, 01:13:06 PM
Hmm, thanks Mac. Good info.


Of course everything was great until I read: "But she hopes the movie's uninhibited sex will make it a hot ticket at the box office".

Ah. So she cares a lot less about "preserving the original intent of the film", than she does about using the sex to sell it. This is why we kinda do need a ratings system of some kind. Because for every Betolucci, we have 400 hacks who just wanna put a tit in the movie so they can sell it.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: Cecil on October 03, 2003, 03:35:53 PM
nc-17 ratings should be worn like badges of honor

"see the movie the mpaa doesnt want you to see. good luck finding it in a thaeter near you, they dont want you to see it either"
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 03, 2003, 03:39:14 PM
Yeah, there you go.

Wanna be ad exec for my films, Cecil?
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: Cecil on October 03, 2003, 03:42:15 PM
sure, ill do it for little or no money, depending on if you can afford to pay me or not
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: ono on October 04, 2003, 05:45:18 PM
Quote from: Cecilnc-17 ratings should be worn like badges of honor
Exactly.

Quote from: Someone, in some article,Last year, Lions Gate trimmed a sex scene in "American Psycho" to get an R -and to get it onto 1,300 screens, where it was moderately successful.
I find it ironic as hell that American Psycho gets an NC-17 for sex, considering the amount of violence in the film.

Quote from: Someone, in some article,Incidentally, big studios don't have the option of sending out films without a rating. The seven majors (Paramount, Universal, etc.) and their art-house affiliates (Disney's Miramax, Sony Pictures Classics, etc.) are members of the MPAA and are contractually bound to have all of their films rated.

As a matter of policy, none of them will release NC-17 films, either.
And, I don't know if anyone already pointed this out or not.  (Someone probably did.)  But this, of course, meant that Tarantino's Kill Bill had to get an R.  And it did.  Even better though was the news was that everything was intact compared to the foreign versions.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: godardian on October 04, 2003, 06:00:12 PM
Isn't it funny how people who don't seem to be in touch even with actual public standards, let alone the views of the most devout filmgoers, have so much sway over how films are distributed, how well they do, and even the creative processs?

Fuck the major studios for being so attached to their precious MPAA memberships. Of course, the MPAA was, at one time, a sort of liberation for them, but now... time to chart a new course, guys!
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 05, 2003, 12:39:23 AM
Just watched Besieged. Damn. Fucking beautiful. I was lovin' it, thinking how much I'm gonna enjoy watching it over and over again on dvd. So the ending's a little open-ended, and I decide to check out reviews on inet, see what the critics had to say.

They all call it a racist, colonialist piece of shit. Wtf? Did they see the same movie I saw? Why are citics so threatened by stylistic flourishes? Bert' told the whole story with visuals and music. That simple. Amazing. But all these critic bastards piss all over it.

I don't get it at all. Critics are gonna tear me a new asshole when I make my films, that's for sure. I'm all about the self-conscious camera moves.

At least Jonathan Rosenbaum saw it for what it was.

I kid you not folks, if you're sick of the way tv has distored what Godard started with Breathless, with their over the top handheld and jump cutting, you gotta see it done right in this film. This is elliptical editing at its peak. I said it before and I say again, Bertolucci is a master -- A MASTER -- of the cinema. Damn.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: chinaski40 on October 06, 2003, 02:40:59 PM
there's too big of a jump between 'R' and 'NC-17'; they should have an 'R' rating, as they do for movies that should only be seen by older kids with their parents and then have an 'A' or something for adult films, but we need to destinguish NC-17 from porn and just good adult films.  I know I stated the obvious and might have been said before, but there's my two cent anyway...
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: Cecil on October 06, 2003, 03:23:05 PM
your idea makes too much sense and is too fair, that is why it will never happen
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: ono on October 06, 2003, 03:36:51 PM
NC-17 was supposed to be a rating to classify legitimate adult fare that wasn't porn, but unfortunately, most people wrongly saw it as a replacement for the self-applied "X," which it wasn't, and that's where the confusion comes in.  The NC-17 as it is now is basically a meaningless symbol of censorship.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 09, 2003, 06:30:40 PM
so I saw Last Tango In Paris last night. I'm fucking blown away. I loved it. I ran out and got it on dvd after work. I'd like to show you all this quote, that seemed improvised by Brando, and was like an open wound, just festering with truth. It's naked and ballsy, and romantic all at the same time:

"You want this man to protect you and take care of you. You want this golden, shining, powerful warrior to build a fortress where you can hide in, where you don't ever have -- you don't have to be afraid, or you don't have to feel  lonely, you never have to feel empty. That's what you want, isn't it? Well, then it won't be long until he'll want you to build a fortress for him out of your tits, and out of your cunt, and out of your hair, and your smile, and the way you smell, and... and someplace where he can feel comfortable enough and secure enough so that he can worship in front of the altar of his own prick."


Fucking hell, that cut right to it. Bertolucci just entered my top ten fav directors list. Damn! Now I'm insane to see his new one...
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: Alethia on October 09, 2003, 10:14:56 PM
Quote from: SoNowThenso I saw Last Tango In Paris last night. I'm fucking blown away. I loved it. I ran out and got it on dvd after work. I'd like to show you all this quote, that seemed improvised by Brando, and was like an open wound, just festering with truth. It's naked and ballsy, and romantic all at the same time:

"You want this man to protect you and take care of you. You want this golden, shining, powerful warrior to build a fortress where you can hide in, where you don't ever have -- you don't have to be afraid, or you don't have to feel  lonely, you never have to feel empty. That's what you want, isn't it? Well, then it won't be long until he'll want you to build a fortress for him out of your tits, and out of your cunt, and out of your hair, and your smile, and the way you smell, and... and someplace where he can feel comfortable enough and secure enough so that he can worship in front of the altar of his own prick."


Fucking hell, that cut right to it. Bertolucci just entered my top ten fav directors list. Damn! Now I'm insane to see his new one...

i absolutely fucking loved that film.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: luctruff on October 10, 2003, 05:11:11 AM
that's one of my favorite films of all time.  was that the scene where he talks to his dead wife, So Now Then?  i've brought it up before in some other thread.  that part always gets me.  is it just me, or this film more about the young girl than the brando character?  has anyone ever read 'the picture of dorian gray'?  it seems to me to be like that one.  the young girl is torn between the loving fiance and the brutish man (not exactly like 'dorian' , but somewhat on the same lines).  i guess the ending could be similiar as well....
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 10, 2003, 08:52:01 AM
The monologue I quoted is from the part where Brando is washing Schneider in the bathtub, and she gets out and says she's in love, and he asks her why, and she says "because he (her fiance) makes me fall in love with him", or something, and Brando goes on to pose these questions-truths...
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: samuelclemens on October 16, 2003, 04:53:25 AM
i absolutely love 'last tango in paris' such a beautiful movie.  one of the best i've ever seen.  but most of his other films, based on the descriptions and reviews, don't sound so good....i know, i shouldn't care about that, but i'm very picky as to what i watch.  i must say, i would like to see 'the conformist', but i can't find it on netflix and no video store has it. anyway,
just remembering the part where he talks to his wife while she lies in the bed of roses almost brings a tear to my eyes.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on October 16, 2003, 08:52:58 AM
I saw The Last Emperor (3 hour 40 min director's cut) on the weekend. Fucking great. Not a dull moment in the whole long massive thing. Transfer was kinda grainy on the dvd, but Storaro reigns supreme as a god among dp's. I wanna get his book through American Cinematographer -- Writing With Light. Anybody read it?


My Bertolucci watchings have so far been wonderful. I need to find Luna, Tragedy Of A Ridiculous Man, and the director's cut of 1900 next...
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: Pwaybloe on October 16, 2003, 11:37:53 AM
Quote from: SoNowThenMy Bertolucci watchings have so far been wonderful. I need to find Luna...

Since you live in Canada, you may get lucky.  But for those who live in the US, we aren't so lucky.  It's never been released here.  

For fun information on the movie, check here (http://www.subcin.com/laluna.html).
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: modage on February 23, 2004, 02:29:15 PM
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In 1972, director Bernardo Bertolucci's Last Tango in Paris suggested a creative new way to incorporate butter in the boudoir, and the film became the first mainstream movie to earn an X rating. More than three decades later, Bertolucci returns to Paris with another eye-opening culinary twist on lovemaking in The Dreamers, proving that you can't make a ménage à trois without breaking a few eggs. This time, an NC-17 marks the spot of Bertolucci's latest adults-only film.

Daring? Sure, but scandal is nothing new for the Italian director, who has refused to shy away from sexuality on-screen his entire career. Four years after Last Tango in Paris, Bertolucci unveiled his most graphic movie yet, the ultraviolent five-hour political epic 1900, which was edited by nearly half an hour to justify its R rating in the States (the complete version was released in 1993 with an NC-17).

In the 20 years since, his vision has extended to embrace a global philosophy with The Last Emperor and Little Buddha before returning to the raw intimacy of Stealing Beauty, his vivid 1996 account of a young woman's sexual awakening. His latest foray, The Dreamers, interweaves politics, eroticism and an homage to the formative films in Bertolucci's life. Here, Bertolucci explains five of the movies that influenced his style.

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Rules of the Game (La Règle du jeu)
(1939, dir: Jean Renoir, starring: Nola Gregor, Marcel Dalio)
First of all, Jean Renoir has this incredible quantity of love. He loves all of his characters, including the "baddies" who are condemned to do bad things. He can't help it. I always saw Renoir as a bridge between the 19th and 20th centuries, possibly because his father, the painter [Pierre-Auguste Renoir], was a great artist of the century before, and I could sense the presence of his father in his vision. In The Rules of the Game, there is this extraordinary feeling that there will soon be a war with many people dying, [a foreboding] which is heaviest during the hunting sequence. Renoir was like a prophet and a poet. He creates a very strong feeling of a world which is disappearing, the old world of his father. There is a scene in Novecento (1900) where a wedding ends in a very tragic way. There's a moment when all the guests are shocked by the murder of a boy, and Robert De Niro says, "It's getting dark. It will soon rain. Everybody is asked to please reenter the villa," exactly like at the end of The Rules of the Game, as if we are seeing that is a society that is able to contain and repress all dramas, a society able to embrace people who are on the edge of a precipice.

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La Dolce Vita
(1960, dir: Federico Fellini, starring: Marcello Mastroianni, Anita Ekberg)
Fellini knew that La Dolce Vita would have some troubles with censorship. As he was finishing postproduction, he asked a few friends and intellectuals in Rome to see it. I was 17 or 18 at the time, and my father took me to Cinecitta, where Fellini was hosting this little screening for 10 people. This was before the post-sync of the film [meaning that the final dialogue would be re-recorded later], so it was all in direct sound, Italian, French, German, a little bit of English, all with the constant presence of the voice of Fellini in the background: "Anita, don't be silly. Smile." He was like a real prophet, imagining and materializing a world on the screen that didn't exist in reality but would come to exist soon. They say, "Life imitates art," and Fellini invented the Via Veneto, he invented the paparazzi, he invented this kind of Catholic Roman aristocracy. Via Veneto was the most boring street in Rome, but after the film, it became famous, and because one photographer in the film was named Paparazzo, those photographers all became "paparazzi." La Dolce Vita really pushed me because it was both very realistic and magic, a kind of magic realism.

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Breathless (À bout de souffle)
(1960, dir: Jean-Luc Godard, starring: Jean-Paul Belmondo, Jean Seberg)
The language of Breathless, that kind of freedom, was very liberating. Jean-Luc Godard was using these provocative jump cuts which nobody had done so far. Jump cuts were considered a kind of mistake, like breaking the rules, and yet I had the feeling that within a few years, I would have seen the temptation to use jump cuts from some of the old American classic masters. These young French directors had all been trained at the Cinémateque Français. They made a kind of political stand against what they had called the "cinéma du papa," in which they would attack respected French directors like Réné Clement, Marcel Carné, but they were completely in love with other directors of the previous generation. There was a shuffling of the cards, inventing new hierarchies of taste. Breathless is this exploitation of Humphrey Bogart influenced by American directors like Samuel Fuller and Nicholas Ray. When Théo and Matthew meet outside the Cinémateque in The Dreamers, I cut a line because it was too much. After Théo says, "Do you know what Godard said about Nicholas Ray? 'Nicholas Ray is cinema,'" Matthew originally answered, "Oh, that says more about Godard than about Ray." I thought we were [indulging] the film buffs too much, and I didn't want to repel people who are not [obsessed with movies].

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Happy Together
(1989; dir: Wong Kar Wai; starring: Leslie Cheung, Tony Leung Chiu-Wai)
I was also influenced by a movie called Happy Together by a young Hong Kong director named Wong Kar Wai. His vision of the cinema language -- the editing and light and camerawork, and also the freedom of how the story is structured -- reminded me a bit of Breathless. I think it's very important to recognize that cinema is in a state of constant mutation (many of my colleagues should know it, although they very often resist it). We recognize the major mutations from the silents to sound, from the black and white of dreams to color, which is more realistic because life is in color. Wong Kar Wai makes new mutations to the language and light; he celebrates a perfection of the imperfection. Now with the high-tech evolution, you have new mutations all the time. For instance, when the Avid [digital editing system] first showed up, some of my colleagues insisted, 'I need to be able to touch the film, to smell the film.' They were suffering, but I immediately jumped on it because I like the mutations, I like the changes. Even before Pietro Scalia and I switched to Avid on Stealing Beauty, I edited The Sheltering Sky on discs using a machine called the CMX 6000.

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Sansho the Bailiff (Sanshô dayû)
(1959; dir: Kenji Mizoguchi; starring: Kinuyo Tanaka, Kyoko Kagawa)
I saw a Mizoguchi film called Sansho the Bailiff with [director Pier Paolo] Pasolini when I was very young, probably 15 or 16. They turned on the light before the film was really finished, and I saw that Pasolini was completely wet with tears. I love it because it was so different, because of the Japanese cultural difference. Mizoguchi had this quality that [Italian Neo-Realist director Roberto] Rossellini also used to have. The two of them knew exactly where the camera had to be, never too close and never too distant. There is a mysterious metaphysical point where they put the camera, which you don't consciously know, but you are positioned at virtually the perfect distance from the subject. When I'm shooting, the challenge is to be able to make the viewer feel what I am feeling in the making of it, which is a sensation in progress. I would like to create the illusion that the film is being made in front of your eyes, that it is in progress and not something pre-cooked.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: lamas on February 23, 2004, 11:42:07 PM
SoNowThen - the Writing With Light book is fucking great.  filled with pictures from every film Storaro has worked on.  he talks alot about inspiration from paintings and gives examples of those paintings.  very cool but very expensive.  the book will REALLY piss you off that there aren't any good copies of The Conformist around.

themodernage02 - what site do those Take 5 director interview things come from?
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on February 24, 2004, 08:58:13 AM
Quotethe Writing With Light book is fucking great

Aaargh!!!!!! Jealous jealous jealous! You lucky bastard....

does he give a lot of info as to his actual technical process, or is it more ideas and theory?
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: godardian on February 24, 2004, 09:15:06 AM
So nice to see Bertolucci giving props to Happy Together. Oh, yeah, the rest are good, too!  :wink:
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: modage on February 24, 2004, 12:37:41 PM
Quote from: lamasthemodernage02 - what site do those Take 5 director interview things come from?
www.moviefone.com
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: lamas on February 25, 2004, 12:23:16 AM
[/quote]

Aaargh!!!!!! Jealous jealous jealous! You lucky bastard....

does he give a lot of info as to his actual technical process, or is it more ideas and theory?[/quote]

calm down.  i didn't say i owned it.  i'm broke as hell.  i just looked through it for a while at the bookstore one day.  i don't remember him getting TOO technical.  it was more about his theories on cinematography.  i'd definitely buy it if i had the cash.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: lamas on February 25, 2004, 12:45:49 AM
check this out for more info:  http://www.storarovittorio.com/versinglese/7writing/7writing.html
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: modage on April 27, 2004, 07:25:44 PM
Quote from: Onomatopita
Quote from: themodernage02[Last Tango in Paris]

this was my first Bertolucci film and it was pretty terrible.  just.....awful.
You must expound on this, like, in the Bertolucci thread.  Because, while I thought the ending was a bit weak, I can't deny the greatness of the film as a whole, and the excellent performance by Brando.  So yes.  And see The Dreamers.  Or, wait, don't, because if you didn't like Last Tango, you'll probably LOATHE The Dreamers.
Quote from: godardian
Culturally important but vastly, vastly overrated Bertolucci: Last Tango in Paris. Same category as I Am Curious... and The Night Porter. Breaking taboos, but dragged down by being so focused on that. Some beautiful moviemaking in those, but all are dated at best.
yeah i am going to have to go with godardian.  i just did not dig this movie at all.  just sloppily written and put together with bad acting and dialogue.  shocking for shockings sake which is just so dated now.  i think the only thing that made this a landmark at the time was that it was shocking, but it just does nothing for me today.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: El Duderino on April 27, 2004, 07:31:45 PM
yes, i actually tuned into this movie a couple nights ago and it was just....bad. with all the kudos bertolucci gets on here, i thought'd it be good. i was wrong.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on April 27, 2004, 08:59:38 PM
Y'all are insane.

Brando at his PEAK.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: lamas on April 27, 2004, 10:06:44 PM
seriously.  Brando is the epitome of cool in Last Tango.  like De Niro in The Deer Hunter, McQueen in Bullitt, Pacino in Godfather II...  how can anyone say Last Tango is a bad movie or it contains bad acting?
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: modage on April 27, 2004, 10:10:28 PM
i dunno.  i watched the movie, was unengaged.  thought it was ridiculous.  the dialogue spoken by brando was unconvincing.  it just seemed bad.  i dont really know how else to put it.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: samsong on July 18, 2004, 04:46:15 AM
I got a chance to see a new print of The Conformist.  This was my first time seeing this film after desperately seeking it for three years.

http://www.xixax.com/viewtopic.php?p=150266#150266
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: Just Withnail on July 18, 2004, 01:50:43 PM
That's a film that seriously needs to get a DVD release.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: A Matter Of Chance on July 19, 2004, 03:40:59 PM
I decided to have a Bertolucci week, starting tonight with Last Tango IN Paris. I couldn't find a copy of The Conformist. Any suggestions/recommendations for tomorrow night?
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: samsong on July 25, 2004, 04:16:58 AM
Quote from: A Matter Of ChanceI decided to have a Bertolucci week, starting tonight with Last Tango IN Paris. I couldn't find a copy of The Conformist. Any suggestions/recommendations for tomorrow night?

I just saw The Spider's Stratagem, which, if you can't find The Conformist, is pretty much the next best thing... after The Dreamers, that is (assuming you haven't seen it.  If you wrote something about it in some other thread or even earlier on in this one, I apologize in advance).  Anyway, The Spider's Stratagem is an excellent tone poem, indicative of the qualities most associate with "European art films" (see RESNAIS and ANTONIONI among others).  It's impressive, moreso after considering Bertolucci and Storaro made it almost right after The Conformist.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: Ghostboy on August 07, 2004, 12:54:15 AM
Quote from: themodernage02thought it was ridiculous.  the dialogue spoken by brando was unconvincing.  it just seemed bad.

I just watched Last Tango for the first time this evening, and Brando's dialogue just jumped out at me as the most brilliant thing about the movie! I hadn't read any of the comments here, so I wasn't going into it with an ear for dialogue...it just sounded so natural, like the kinda nonsense people talk about while they're lying in bed. The lame jokes and so on, with those random moments of run-on profundity like what So Now Then quoted a few pages back. I didn't love the movie the same way I loved The Dreamers, but I think that's simply because I can relate to The Dreamers so much more. This is a more mature piece,  striking in its non-gratuitousness (particularly because its renowned for its sexual content) and overwhelming sense of emptiness (not in regards to the movie, but to the characters).

So this is the fourth Bertolucci film I've seen; the only one I didn't like that much was the first one I saw,  Stealing Beauty. I completely agree with what So Now Then said about Besieged -- it's achingly beautiful, and the criticisms it received (namely Ebert's) are ridiculous.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: thadius sterling on June 28, 2005, 01:29:41 AM
Indeed, sorry for the double post about Bertoluci and thank you for the welcome. I haven't yet seen The Dreamers or any of the other Bertoluci films I plan on picking up but I did want to reply to something,

I think this b-board is far better than imdb's b-board concerning film. imdb is full of people who keep their opinions in their jerkoff hand. (but then again that's just another opinion right?)

Where as here, even (if not especially) when I disagree with people, I can actually see where they are coming from and respect them, and know that they are valid. I have yet to see any ignorance here. And I did find the search feature, thank you! :) Sorry again for the double post and thank you for locking it.
Title: Bertolucci
Post by: SiliasRuby on June 28, 2005, 10:42:58 PM
Yeah, no problem. Welcome to internet film heaven.
On Bertoluci: all I have seen is Last tango which freaked me out on how realistic the film seemed.
The dreamers was a really enjoyable experience as well. I really connected with The Dreamers alot, how confusing and explicit sex can be with the dillusioned young.
Title: Re: Bertolucci
Post by: w/o horse on March 09, 2006, 01:52:03 PM
La Commare Secca was in the DVD player last night.  It was exciting to see Bertolucci as an excited young filmmaker.  A lot of energy and passion in the camera.  It held a quick pace too, which I didn't expect.  Given that pace, the end felt like a running man just stopping and sitting down, but I was rewarded enough before for that to not care.  Typically there were a lot of brush strokes that he would repeat in his career.

It's not an amazing movie but it is really well made and watching it is inspiring.
Title: Re: Bertolucci
Post by: SoNowThen on March 10, 2006, 10:11:49 AM
Yeah, it's really, really solid. Finding out that it was done by a 19 year old is either incredibly depressing, or hugely inspiring...