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Started by mutinyco, July 30, 2003, 10:21:09 AM

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mutinyco

#60
August 16, 2003, 10:23:03 AM
No offense, but that Godard quote is really idiotic. It doesn't mean anything.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

SoNowThen

#61
August 16, 2003, 07:15:13 PM
Muty, only someone who's as big a 'Berg fan as you would truly not like a brilliant Godard quote.

It was in reference to the talk we all were having about "what is art?", and also ties into my feeling that cinema is like a religion (which Scorsese always talks about too). But most of all that it is almost undefinable, we could never really arrive at an answer, but we know it's powerful as hell, so it becomes an act of faith. Which, imo, is the strongest thing a human being can have. It could destroy us, yes, but it could also be our saving grace.

:mrgreen:
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

mutinyco

#62
August 16, 2003, 07:38:17 PM
It's a dumb quote. It doesn't mean anything. If you've worked in multiple mediums you'd realize this. I draw, paint, write music, act, write scripts and prose -- in various quantities at various times. At any given time whatever medium I've worked in was the medium I thought would best represent what I was trying to express. It's a totally ignorant statement on Godard's part.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

SoNowThen

#63
August 16, 2003, 07:39:24 PM
Sadly, it is you who is ignorant my friend.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

mutinyco

#64
August 16, 2003, 07:40:29 PM
And as Tarantino said, Godard is college-level thinking about film. I'm not entirely convinced he's ever made a truly full-bodied mature film.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

SoNowThen

#65
August 16, 2003, 07:41:27 PM
My Life To Live
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

mutinyco

#66
August 16, 2003, 07:42:44 PM
Hardly. Godard's statement is ignorant. And that must mean you, too, for using it. It's a totally abstracted bullshit quote that offers no observational evidence to back up what's being said. It's one man's opinion blown up to grandiose nonsense.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

SoNowThen

#67
August 16, 2003, 07:46:28 PM
I will happily accept being clumped into the same category as Godard. That may have been the best compliment anyone has ever given me.

How can one give "evidence" on a subjective opinion-based subject? In film, one man's opinion is all that matters for that film. Cinema is abstract. Ideas are abstract. We must keep asking questions, not supplying answers, because, inevitably, as we grow and change, so will our answers. So only questions remain.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

mutinyco

#68
August 16, 2003, 07:58:07 PM
It's a dumb statement because what he said is easily applicable to ANY art form. Movies are more influential than music? Novels? Paintings? I consider myself a filmmaker first and foremost. But this is a genuinely dumb statement. If he were saying something like: "Movies are the most complete artistic medium because they encompass all of the other mediums -- architecture, music, writing..." But he's not. It's gibberish.

If being compared to Godard is your type of compliment, more power to ya. He's the only filmmaker whose made 3 films I've turned off and not finished.

I've always considered him a bit of a fraud. Which isn't to say I haven't enjoyed his work. But he was no Kubrick. Or Fellini. Or Coppola. He doesn't have the ability to create films on the level of Barry Lyndon, La Dolce Vita, or Apocalypse Now. Films that push the medium forward on every level.

I enjoyed Breathless. But on no level did I consider it a masterpiece. It was an amusing diversion.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

SoNowThen

#69
August 16, 2003, 08:02:49 PM
He's not claiming that movies are "better". The context of the quote was from an interview in which it was discussed that cinema was not taken as seriously as other "arts", which it wasn't in France at the time.

I truly hope that over the span of my career I would get favorably compared to Godard. That would mean I have taken chances and pushed boundaries and loved and lived cinema (and hopefully with a little bit of a sense of humor).

Go see Pierrot, like I said. Maybe you will like it and get into him. It can only be a good thing.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

mutinyco

#70
August 16, 2003, 08:15:20 PM
I wrote the fucking article that mentioned Pierrot. Hello? They're playing about 20 movies. I could've picked anything to say.

And the correct answer as to why movies aren't taken as seriously is because THEY COST MONEY. If somebody's invested a huge amount of money in your movie it DAMN WELL BETTER MAKE IT BACK! That means playing to your audience. There's NOTHING wrong with that. As long as you stay true to yourself.

His answer was goop. He offered an opinion where there's observational evidence toward a simple fact.

Movies are inherently for the populous. Yeah, you can make small budget films where you control everything and make no money. If that's your thing. I prefer filmmakers that have been able to bridge both worlds like those I mentioned before.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

SoNowThen

#71
August 16, 2003, 08:30:33 PM
Quote from: mutinycoI wrote the fucking article that mentioned Pierrot.

Well, you should go see it then. What a wonderful opportunity, like you said in the article.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

mutinyco

#72
August 16, 2003, 08:35:11 PM
Hello? I've seen it, you moron! I've seen lots of his films! I just don't think much of them.

I operate a movie website. I interview filmmakers and talent. I make movies. I ride without training wheels.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

Alethia

#73
August 16, 2003, 08:36:30 PM
Quote from: mutinycoI ride without training wheels.

hey, me too!

Pubrick

#74
August 17, 2003, 02:54:18 AM
Quote from: mutinycoHello?
hello.
under the paving stones.
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