Nacho Libre

[pete]

maybe the film just isn't funny enough, but I feel like all these criticisms against it and suggestions of what could've happened are the very hackneyed things that Hess tries to avoid: cookie cutter comedies with these phony dramatic arcs and payoffs and romantic tension and hero and his fucking "visible goal" and whatnot.  fuck that shit man, just make a funny movie.  why do I need a reason to root for him?  an orphanage is reason enough.  the whole set up payoff character development thing is lame.  Those are the vices that ruined Saturday Night Live movies.  As soon as the characters hit the big screen they all of a sudden need dumb motivations and villains.  those are the worst of the comedies.  Old School and Wedding Crashers would've been so much funnier if they didn't have the girls or the bad guys or the rising action.  Ron Burgundy didn't have a bad guy.  These plot devices are always in the way of comedy and action movies, rendering them generic and boring.  Marx Brothers never had any of that.  Groucho sets a goal, then forgets it as soon as he sees a girl or an opportunity for a pun.  Stephen Chow always makes his underdog horny and cocky.  Chaplin and Keaton were geniuses, but they ruined studio comedies forever with their serious storylines.  Just like every pop band after the Beatles takes itself too seriously to be any fun, every comedy strives for some kinda City of Lights epiphany.  Hess might not be funny, but it's at least a step in the right direction.  It's time we stop modeling comedy after books and fables and just focus on putting in as many jokes as possible. 

[grand theft sparrow]

See, you bring up Stephen Chow.  Both Shaolin Soccer and Kung Fu Hustle had those same formulaic devices that you're complaining about and they were both funny movies.  And the Marx Brothers definitely had those devices going on.  But the Marx Brothers also knew how to tuck jokes inside of jokes and it helped that they each had a different style and it all worked together beautifully.

I understand where you're coming from but my frustration with what wasn't in Nacho comes more from the fact that, had they added things like that, there would have been opportunities for MORE jokes.  Just because Hess is doing it differently doesn't mean it's better.  He's really just doing the same thing as your average Rob Schneider film, just with more interesting characters and quirkier jokes.  So I applaud his sense of humor but structure-wise, it's not much different.

I agree with you for the most part: if it's funny, who cares?  But you do the "putting in as many jokes as possible" thing one way and you get Anchorman or Naked Gun, where your characters are funny in and of themselves and the situations they're in give them a reason to be funny.  Great.  You do it another way and you get Scary Movie 4, where the movie is just an excuse to string together cheap slapstick gags.  Nacho splits the difference.  I like Jack Black and I found Nacho funny, but I have the same feelings about it that I did about Napoleon: great characters but everything doesn't quite work for them.  There was a little bit of romantic tension in the movie but the fact that that tension was a motivation for Nacho but never resolved is frustrating, especially since that resolution could have been hilarious in and of itself.  That's what bugs me about Jared Hess, he can develop funny characters but he doesn't care to tell any stories, he just likes to set up situations.

[pete]

it was kinda like 4 am in taiwan when I typed this.  so the frustration also came out of watching bad movies on cable with my buddies as well.  my frustration with the desperation to tell a story still stands.  I think stephen chow and groucho began their scenes under the guise of an action movie, but quickly abandoned the urgency of the plot and the conflict as soon as they entered these elaborate, almost musical-number-like gags.  for the most part, stephen chow's gags in shaolin soccer were out-of-his character, and a lot of the gags had nothing to do with wanting to win the soccer match.  same thing with duck soup.  sometimes the heroes would add insult to injury by messing up on purpose.  this has nothing to do with nacho libre 'cause he doesn't really do that.  just saying.

[tpfkabi]

the main difference between Hess and Anderson to me is how Anderson, as wacky and surreal as his stories can be, will hit you with these lines that hit harder than the most serious of dramas.

something like when Zissou says, "I hate fathers and never wanted to be one," etc. that might not be the exact quote but i think you know what i'm referring to.

[ᾦɐļᵲʊʂ]

has Hess said he admired Wes Anderson in any interviews?

an above thread said Elfman's name was off, but his name is on the poster.
apparently Beck's music still made it because there was one Beck song i haven't heard before and some other bits.
i need to look up the soundtrack.


p.s. Walrus, did it seem odd to you that the spoiler scene you mentioned had no payoff? Seems like after something like that happened that character would show up again. This was brought up by my friend after the movie. I wonder if the possible payoff scenes hit the cutting room floor.

i think the scene was its own payoff. the fact that it had nothing to do with the rest of the movie is fine. the rest of the movie sucked.

I don't mind a few really random jokes when they come out of nowhere and aren't discussed anymore.  That's pretty hilarious to me in a comedy, a farce, which happened to be Nacho Libre's aim. 

I don't mind Hess' directing aesthetically, I think his style is really developing (piggy backing nicely on Wes Anderson) but I think his writing has a lot of room to grow (that's the best way I can put it).

[tpfkabi]

SPOILERS


these were the same two characters that had the whips, right?

it just doesn't seem to make sense. Hess shows them fighting these two guys, then they show up later in the movie and mess with Nacho's transportation. it just seems too random as if some scene linking the events is missing. also that kind of reaction to what the guys were doing (popping a tire i believe?) doesn't seem to fit in with the rest of the film. but it's just my opinion and it's a comedy after all.

[gob]

Hell I thought it was hilarious.

[RegularKarate]

What? you don't have anything to say about Spiderman 2?

[tpfkabi]

i still can't believe there's not a soundtrack. i remember liking it and would have probably bought it after i saw the movie.

[MacGuffin]

i still can't believe there's not a soundtrack. i remember liking it and would have probably bought it after i saw the movie.

Not Sure How Much Elfman Appears in NACHO LIBRE Soundtrack
Source: Cinescape

On October 17th, Lakeshore Records will release the soundtrack to NACHO LIBRE, the Jack Black comedy about the monk who aspires to be a professional wrestler. Danny Elfman came in at the last second to score this film when former composer, popstar Beck, withdrew from the project. There is no word yet, however, on how much if any of Danny Elfman's score will be included, and how many songs will occupy the CD space.

"This isn't the great Elfman score that makes me want to run out and buy the CD like EDWARD SCISSORHANDS or MEN IN BLACK did," wrote Scoremaster in www.aintitcoolnews.com back in June when he previewed the score. "This is the great Elfman score that works on a more cerebral level as an afterthought within the technical context of the film. Elfman approaches the film much like a television sitcom - small, punctuating cues which are frequently interrupted or cadenced after a few small phrases. The music changes drastically on a dime to fit the dynamics of the scene and he's careful not to over-saturate the film with unnecessary music."

Speaking of Elfman, he will appear as a guest on "Soundcheck" on September 27, 2006, at 2pm EST. The show, which airs daily on WNYC New York Public Radio, will feature Elfman speaking with host John Schaefer about his new live concert album, Serenada Schizophrana, which is his first orchestral composition written specifically for a concert hall, while also discussing his other current projects and future plans.

"Soundcheck" airs every day at 2:00 PM on 93.9 FM or at 3:00 PM on XM satellite radio. You could also tune in live online at http://www.wnyc.org/shows/soundcheck. The show is also available as a podcast.

[modage]

I just saw this tonight. I wasn't a big fan of Napoleon Dynamite, and although I think I like this better in some ways (the Mexican setting is just wonderful), objectively I'd say this is about its equal - better in some ways, worse in others. I was hoping there'd be some great Mike White magic, but I'd never have guessed he helped write it if his name hadn't been in the credits.

Oh, and regardless of who wrote it, the theme music/song is awesome.

agreed.  corn in the eye was pretty much the biggest/(only?) laugh in the movie.  it was weird, so i wanted to love it, but it didnt quite work.  it looked great though, whoever his cinematographer/production&costume designer were, they're awesome.

[pete]

dunno what you guys are talking about, it was pretty consistently funny.  a lot of the gags were pretty simple--item trajectories, farting, screaming, grossness...etc. but they were all delivered well.