The 2004 Xixax DEKAPENTICON

Started by Jeremy Blackman, January 07, 2004, 02:52:19 AM

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ono

#15
January 07, 2004, 09:07:31 AM
No Eyes Wide Shut.  For shame.  That film is brilliant.  Just saw it again a few nights ago.  At least it made the first cut.  And like P said, three Kubricks says it all.  Now I know which films I need to see next, once I actually get Netflix going for myself.  I'm happy Punch-Drunk Love made it.  Having just written about it and watched it so much, I'm more and more convinced of its brilliance.  And yay for Fight Club.  I too think Mulholland Drive and Taxi Driver are out of place, but if a Lynch and Scorsese had to make the list, I'm glad it's those two, and not, say, Blue Velvet and/or GoodFellas.  Bleh.  Question for those who voted for 2001: Why?  I mean, I can understand how revolutionary a film it was for its time, but is that its merit?  How entertaining is it really?  Maybe I need to see it again.  Overall, I'm happy with the list, and the graphics are nice, too.  Great job to those who organized this.

Here's an idea: what say we turn Xixax into a place with a little bit more content?  There have been several of these group efforts, and this place has become such a community.  The home (http://www.xixax.com/) would house lists such as these, notices of chats where we watch movies together, notifications of events, and film articles.  The forums would be moved off to something like http://www.xixax.com/forums/ Rather than them all getting lost in the forum shuffle, we'd have a concrete place (URL) to refer to if that was to happen, plus, we'd have unique content with all the film essays floating around the site (stuff mutinyco, The Silver Bullet, SHAFTR, etc. have written).

SoNowThen

#16
January 07, 2004, 09:38:30 AM
Taxi Driver out of place? Is this some kinda sick joke?

Put a smile on my face to see 8 1/2 & Vivre Sa Vie there!!!
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

godardian

#17
January 07, 2004, 09:42:20 AM
I wouldn't have put Pulp Fiction or PDL in the top 15... and if there were an ANTI-Dekapenticon, it would still be too good for Fight Club, IMO. But yes, this does seem to be a representative list. And Fight Club is the only movie on there that I actually dislike, which is a much better ratio than I expected.  

As for 2001 not being "entertaining"; isn't a mind-shattering, medium-shattering cinematic experience more memorable and important than something that just entertains? 2001 doesn't just "entertain"- it engages in such a mind-blowing way as to well deserve its place on the list.

I'm pleasantly surprised that Mulholland Dr. made it so high on the list, too. After Lost Highway, I would've expected that Lynch's best work was behind him. Then along came this movie that, after arguing with myself for a bit, I saw as Lynch's masterwork- the pinnacle and ultimate coalescence of all the original, beautiful, extraordinary things he's been doing with cinema since the beginning of his career.
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

ono

#18
January 07, 2004, 09:46:38 AM
Quote from: godardianI wouldn't have put Pulp Fiction or PDL in the top 15... and if there were an ANTI-Dekapenticon, it would still be too good for Fight Club, IMO. But yes, this does seem to be a representative list. And Fight Club is the only movie on there that I actually dislike, which is a much better ratio than I expected.
For the life of me, I will never understand what some people have against Fight Club.  I guess it's that The Usual Suspects syndrome talked about here earlier.  I mean, I love Fight Club, so I'm a little more adamant about defending it, but The Usual Suspects is a good movie that way too many people like to give a bad rap for no apparent reason.  Fight Club is the same way, only better.
Quote from: godardianAs for 2001 not being "entertaining"; isn't a mind-shattering, medium-shattering cinematic experience more memorable and important than something that just entertains? 2001 doesn't just "entertain"- it engages in such a mind-blowing way as to well deserve its place on the list.
Yep, I need to see it again.

godardian

#19
January 07, 2004, 10:09:22 AM
Quote from: Onomatopoeia
For the life of me, I will never understand what some people have against Fight Club.  I guess it's that The Usual Suspects syndrome talked about here earlier.  I mean, I love Fight Club, so I'm a little more adamant about defending it, but The Usual Suspects is a good movie that way too many people like to give a bad rap for no apparent reason.  Fight Club is the same way, only better.
.

I can assure you that my negative opinion on Fight Club is based on my own critical analysis of the film itself and is not in any way a mere reaction to popular regard for it.
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

SoNowThen

#20
January 07, 2004, 10:11:26 AM
yeah, you're wrong about Fight Club, but that's cool


:)
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

ono

#21
January 07, 2004, 10:12:31 AM
Quote from: godardianI can assure you that my negative opinion on Fight Club is based on my own critical analysis of the film itself and is not in any way a mere reaction to popular regard for it.
Oh, I completely expected that.  Knowing you, I never thought any other way.  :)

SoNowThen

#22
January 07, 2004, 10:16:53 AM
anyway, can we start campaining for next year now?

I'd like all who haven't yet, to go out and watch Walkabout and The Conformist.
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

Pubrick

#23
January 07, 2004, 10:18:59 AM
i didn't think the XIXAX DEKAPENTICON would be an annual event.
under the paving stones.

ono

#24
January 07, 2004, 10:19:11 AM
Quote from: SoNowThenI'd like all who haven't yet, to go out and watch Walkabout and The Conformist.
I'm gonna add them to my Netflix query now.  I'm like a kid in a candy store.  :-D

SoNowThen

#25
January 07, 2004, 10:20:44 AM
Quote from: Pi didn't think the XIXAX DEKAPENTICON would be an annual event.

I think that's the beauty of it. I am now quite interested to see how the list will change...
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

ono

#26
January 07, 2004, 10:21:08 AM
Quote from: Pi didn't think the XIXAX DEKAPENTICON would be an annual event.
Why not?  Opinions change.  New movies get released.  Older movies devalue over time or age well.

Pubrick

#27
January 07, 2004, 10:27:07 AM
i just didn't think so is all.

one year is hardly a time frame to judge whether a film has aged well or "devalued".
under the paving stones.

cron

#28
January 07, 2004, 10:27:13 AM
QuoteOpinions change. New movies get released. Older movies devalue over time or age well.
and when it rains, it pours.
context, context, context.

SoNowThen

#29
January 07, 2004, 10:33:13 AM
Quote from: Pi just didn't think so is all.

one year is hardly a time frame to judge whether a film has aged well or "devalued".

I agree with that.

But this is the good thing: in a year, I'll have seen so many more important films that I didn't have a chance to see while we made this list. So I just wanna see what films creep up there as more people discover them...
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.
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