Author Topic: Dogville  (Read 27223 times)

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Weak2ndAct

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Dogville
« on: July 12, 2003, 04:39:50 AM »
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Oh lordy.  Von Trier fans get ready, our favorite Danish lunatic has seriously got a masterpiece on his hands.  

I heard all the reviews and blurbs, but what I saw was completely different than what I expected.  Considering the set-up (it's on a stage, no real sets) and design, I was expecting a very presentational film.  Surprisingly enough, it was quite visual and stunning.  The cast is top notch (my only gripe is that a few players were underused-- Jeremy Davies, Lauren Bacall) and we even get to see old Sydney himself in action.  Kidman rocks and Paul Bettany is quite good as well.  Contrary to everything that I've heard-- the movie is actually quite funny.  

The best part: the end seems to fall into typical Von Trier-sacrifical-lamb territory, but then turns quite suddenly into something we've all been waiting for and wanting.  A couple "oh shit!" moments to boot.  All around, a great film, definitely to be one of the year's best.  

It's a travesty that Kidman wins Oscars for fake noses and 20 min. of screen time, this is something she should win for.  Balls out acting with nothing to hide behind.

RegularKarate

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Dogville
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2003, 12:24:10 PM »
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rustinglass

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Dogville
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2003, 04:28:20 PM »
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I just saw it.

I don't understand the awful critics the film has had.
I wasn't disapointed but I wasn't overwhelmed either, I don't think it's as good as breaking the waves or dancer but still a very good film and one of the year's best.
The setting worked brilliantly, lighting and editing were perfect, excellent acting (even the children) and great great storytelling, to which John Hurt's haunting voice(as Max von Sydow's in Europa) ads a lot.
We are used to see the gradual degradation of characters in von Trier's work but it climaxes in something that, being different than that which we are all used too, leaves us equally disturbed.
"In Serbia a lot of people hate me because they want to westernise, not understanding that the western world is bipolar, with very good things and very bad things. Since they don't have experience of the west, they even believe that western shit is pie."
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godardian

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Dogville
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2003, 07:13:07 PM »
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Quote from: rustinglass
I just saw it.

I don't understand the awful critics the film has had.
I wasn't disapointed but I wasn't overwhelmed either, I don't think it's as good as breaking the waves or dancer but still a very good film and one of the year's best.
The setting worked brilliantly, lighting and editing were perfect, excellent acting (even the children) and great great storytelling, to which John Hurt's haunting voice(as Max von Sydow's in Europa) ads a lot.
We are used to see the gradual degradation of characters in von Trier's work but it climaxes in something that, being different than that which we are all used too, leaves us equally disturbed.


I'm looking forward to this one.
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mutinyco

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« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2003, 09:24:26 PM »
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I saw it at the NYFF. I dozed off. When I finally got up at the end I've never felt so good stretching my legs.
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kotte

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« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2003, 10:03:43 PM »
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SPOILER

Saw it a couple of months ago...

I loved it...it's great...

If you're into it, you'll forget about the whole stage-setting after a couple of minutes...

Best shot: The camera pulls back from Stellan Skarsgard raping Nicole revealing the whole village going about their business as usual...heartbreaking.

mutinyco

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« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2003, 10:01:47 PM »
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Eh...I think Von Trier's films are manipulative garbarge. A jaundiced view of America from somebody who knows nothing about America.
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kotte

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« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2003, 06:01:19 AM »
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Quote from: mutinyco
Eh...I think Von Trier's films are manipulative garbarge. A jaundiced view of America from somebody who knows nothing about America.


Yeah, but it's his point of view...he's not asking people to replace their opinions for his.

phil marlowe

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« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2003, 07:18:06 AM »
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i saw the movie a half year ago and i sensed that i could go and be my favourite trier film but need to see it at least one more time in order to fully get what he was saying to me.

mutinyco

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« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2003, 07:23:01 AM »
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The problem is: his point of view doesn't hold water. There's nothing about Dogville from its manipulative, rapist townsfolk to its Barton Fink finale that connects to anything I understand about America. I think Von Trier thought that something needed to be said about America at this particular moment and that he was the person to do it -- but he didn't achieve his goal. He's never been here. He's essentially a communist, socialist at best.

I think the film was an interesting attempt, but it just doesn't work or hold attention. He's hitting too many beats that he's already hit (let's punish a woman and manipulate the audience beyond comprehension), and references to Our Town or Barry Lyndon aren't going to save it. And another thing: IT"S WAY TOO LONG. He could've accomplished his goal in half the amount of time.
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kotte

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« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2003, 07:39:52 AM »
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Quote from: mutinyco
The problem is: his point of view doesn't hold water.


What do you mean? It's his opinion. His view...

If I'm blind and insists that the sun is blue, that's a POV not holding water...

The man's got eyes and ears...That's how he perceives things.

The movie is about people...not just american people.

mutinyco

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« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2003, 07:50:04 AM »
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It's pretty well directed at America. That WAS his point. And considering he never leaves Denmark and only knows about America from the news and our movies, that's pretty close to a blind man claiming the sun is blue. Especially if he's trying to make the type of statement he's making -- ie: We're selfish and cruel toward the underclasses, overly violent, dog eat dog, our silly innocent small town American images...

I think when you get to the end credits and hear David Bowie's Young Americans playing over images of homeless and downtrodden, it's a very specific commentary. And while I primarily agree with what his intentions are, I don't think he understands America well enough to make such statements. So yes, it's his opinion, but eveybody's got one. What makes some better than others is the amount of fact and comprehension brought to it.

Also, on a much simpler level, I just didn't find the movie the least bit entertaining.
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kotte

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« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2003, 08:00:25 AM »
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These days you don't actually need to live in america to understand and have opinions.

The world we're living in right now, we all know just as much about your country as you do. I'm exaggerating, I know but...

According to Von Trier, his opinions are made up from books and novel mainly. News and what other people told him...

You don't make movies from what you've found out from other movies.

I can see how you didn't enjoy it...It's a love it or hate it film.

mutinyco

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« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2003, 08:04:56 AM »
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Yes it is.
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rustinglass

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« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2003, 03:43:19 PM »
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There is a portuguese critic that says:

"This is..........this is us!
Humanity at it's best."

I understand the anti-america feeling of the movie, but everyone is entitled to an opinion just as everyone is entitled to disagree with it.

But to say that his films are manipulative garbage just because you disagree with him... I mean would you have the same opinion if he had done this film on a serbian town in the 80s? No scots gave him shit when he made breaking the waves, nor did germans when he made europa, if anything, they praised him for making a good film.

If nothing else you can enjoy this film for it's technical treatment which is very good. And I must say that lars is a director that fully comprehends the technical side of filmaking as well as the emotional side and he is a genious on how to deal with actors.
"In Serbia a lot of people hate me because they want to westernise, not understanding that the western world is bipolar, with very good things and very bad things. Since they don't have experience of the west, they even believe that western shit is pie."
-Emir Kusturica

 

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