Fahrenheit 9/11

[pete]

it begins with a cannes palm d'or, a talking head, a philip glass-sounding score, a conspiracy theory...etc., things for people who've already been converted.
Bowling for Columbine was pretty cool that it did well "for a documentary", but all the things Michael Moore promised didn't really happen--shaking the nation, getting everyone into a discussion on violence, making an impact...etc., America still went to war, and he even got booed for saying the same thing he won the award for.

[NEON MERCURY]

pete,

i like your new av ..the old one was Too billy elliot meets "data" from the goonies for my tastes...
thank you for making me alot  happier...

[pete]

you won't think that after you've seen Ping Pong.

[xerxes]

this seems like a pretty good place to post this.

[Pubrick]

this seems like a pretty good place to post this.

that's pretty good, will get larger audience this way..

[coffeebeetle]

Bowling for Columbine was pretty cool that it did well "for a documentary", but all the things Michael Moore promised didn't really happen--shaking the nation, getting everyone into a discussion on violence, making an impact...etc., America still went to war, and he even got booed for saying the same thing he won the award for.

I think you're being pessimistic.  You can't be serious in thinking the movie was going to bring about near instantaneous, sweeping change, right?  I don't think it can be denied that Bowling opened up many peoples' eyes to what's happening to this country.

it begins with a cannes palm d'or, a talking head, a philip glass-sounding score, a conspiracy theory...etc., things for people who've already been converted.

Is this what makes "indie"?

[pete]

I think you're being condescending.  putting "indie" in quotes like I'm some kinda dumb Hollywood watching kid.  I was speaking on behalf of the people that Michael Moore wants to reach to, something that Miramax has better chances with than Focus Features and IFC.  By "indie" I meant c'mon, average Americans won't want to go see a movie like that in the summer.  Not with that type of campaigning.  Especially not the Joe Public that Carl Rove and his cohorts are spending millions over.  I didn't say philip glass music makes "indie", I was saying "too indie for the average American".

pessemistic?  I wasn't the one who booed him on the academy night nor was I one of the 70%+ people who supported us going into the war.  whose eyes did Bowling open?  and how?  maybe high school kids who are never gonna touch a gun in their lives, and whose impressionable minds will be molded anyways when they get to the colleges.  But the people who are violent, who want to shoot things and people up, who are racist, who are greedily selling guns to youngster, who promote violence--none of them is going to watch this film, not their children either.  Can you imagine the two kids from Columbine watching this film and walk away with a sweeter brighter understanding of the American society?  

why can't I be serious when I wanted a more visible sign of the film's impact?  Michael Moore was serious when he told everyone in a prophet-like fashion via emails and other forms of aggressive campaigns.   that happened for months, and you were seeing the TV spots everywhere, in the magazines and papers.  Right now the new Bush movie is two weeks from opening and all we've got is that little philip glass talking heads trailer.  It looked like the Fog of War trailer with a chubbier guy asking the questions.  go out in the open space man, I dunno where you live, but look around, show them the trailer, and see if they wanna go see it.

[Pedro]

Pedro the trailer critic says:  That trailer is shit.  Good call pete.

[mutinyco]

go out in the open space man, I dunno where you live, but look around, show them the trailer, and see if they wanna go see it.

Um, the distribution deals were only signed a few days ago. I'm sure there will be plenty of hype before it opens.

BTW, has anybody paid attention to the Weinsteins' company's name: The Fellowship Adventure Group. A silly LOTR reference.

[MacGuffin]

BTW, has anybody paid attention to the Weinsteins' company's name: The Fellowship Adventure Group.

Otherwise known as: FAG

A silly LOTR reference.

[rustinglass]

HA! hilarious!

[coffeebeetle]

By "indie" I meant c'mon, average Americans won't want to go see a movie like that in the summer.  Not with that type of campaigning.

Pete, I apologize if I sounded condescending.  That was not my intention.  Perhaps I give the American public too much credit.  However, I think that his films are very accessible and that's what makes them great.  Will most people go to see the latest bigbangsmashemup popcorn debacle?  Absolutely.  But I also think that alot of people are going to see this film too.

pessemistic?  I wasn't the one who booed him on the academy night nor was I one of the 70%+ people who supported us going into the war.

I think because of the way this administration is handling things, people are going to sit up and take notice of this film.    That's my hope anyway.  This film is needed now more than ever.  And I think the political climate has changed quite a bit since the Academy awards.  Some polls are suggesting that Bush might be on the out and out, so to speak.  

whose eyes did Bowling open?  and how?  maybe high school kids who are never gonna touch a gun in their lives, and whose impressionable minds will be molded anyways when they get to the colleges.  But the people who are violent, who want to shoot things and people up, who are racist, who are greedily selling guns to youngster, who promote violence--none of them is going to watch this film, not their children either.  Can you imagine the two kids from Columbine watching this film and walk away with a sweeter brighter understanding of the American society?

I know quite a few people who have seen it and I've had very heated, engaging conversations about it with them.  I simply can't dismiss this film by saying it hasn't stimulated some critical thinking and opinions.  But that's just me.  

why can't I be serious when I wanted a more visible sign of the film's impact?

Wal-Mart stopped selling hand guns.  Rome didn't fall in one day.

[Ravi]

Part of the audience will be pro-Bush people who are curious about the controversy, and I'm sure those people will tell their friends, and the film's contents will get media coverage.  Whether your ignorant Joe six-pack who thinks patriotism is never questioning the government will see this film is up to debate.  More people know about Moore now than they did when Bowling for Columbine was released, so depending on how wide Fahrenheit 911 opens, it will probably do close to BFC's total on opening weekend.

[NEON MERCURY]

...i m a conservative fellow and i can t wait to see this. ..the hype surrounding this movie has gotten me very excited..and i enjoyed BFC.  i want to see why iot got the palme also [since it was the first doc in amny of years to get it].....and as some of you may know lynchs wild at hearteceived the palme.. so whatever film gets the award it must be a triumph. ..but as i stated earlier i think moores recipe for a documentary is one part truth and the other part propaganda and stirs it together in his "own" pot and boil it. ..i think even the moore supporters aren t that silly to think that EVERYTHING HE SHOWS ONSCREEN IS ABSOLUTE TRUTH IN EVERY ASPECT....even though its labeled as a doc F 9/11 will be edited and created and [molded] to moores opinion...and its fascinating to me...he makes docs very interesting and fun to watch.  to bwe honest w/ you guys i would not have owned or respected the docs as much as i do now w/o seeing BFC...but i am not saying that F 9/11 is complete falsities..it will contain both......remember documentary is an expressive art form........................................................................

[Jeremy Blackman]

but as i stated earlier i think moores recipe for a documentary is one part truth and the other part propaganda and stirs it together in his "own" pot and boil it

Moore's documentaries are not cold fact reporting, obviously. They're opinionated analysis. But when you watch Farenheit 9/11, please please please Neon do not just dismiss the cold facts and the footage as part of his "propaganda."

And as we discussed before, the definition of propaganda (as we use it) is something that's used by the powerful and the elite to legitimize their own power and crush dissent. Moore doesn't represent or speak for elite media (nor does any leftist organization), the government, or any dominant interest. A brief glimpse into history will tell you that the liars are most often the ones in power (who write history books).