elephant

Started by gjg 4 REEL, September 23, 2003, 01:45:14 PM

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SoNowThen

#150
December 10, 2003, 10:13:30 AM
yeah, I just meant slow lenses if you really wanted a shitty depth of field.



oh, I heard that the vision t stocks are only tungsten balanced, is that true? so then the 800t (with the converter filter for daylight) wouldn't be that fast for night shooting?? yet I thought that was the point of having the 800t -- great latitude for night shooting...
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

pete

#151
December 10, 2003, 11:41:22 AM
I thought vision 800 is currently the fatest stock around.
there was a scene in 21 grams, when benecio's character goes home for his birthday party, and the stock shifts from 500t to 800t in the same scene.
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot."
- Buster Keaton

SoNowThen

#152
December 10, 2003, 11:44:25 AM
yeah, I too figured it was the fastest, but if it's only for tungsten light, then what's the point?
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

RegularKarate

#153
December 10, 2003, 12:54:46 PM
I don't get your question, SoNowThen.

Vision 800 T is the fastest, but all T stocks are Tungsten balanced (and the D stocks are daylight, of course).  It gives you more latitude for night scenes:



Lens: 29 mm (zoom)
Filter: none
Aperture: T 3.5 (EI 800)
Incident Light Levels
(Tungsten 2930 K)
 Key = T 3.5 (25 fc)
 Fill = T 1.8 (5 fc)
 Backlight = T 2.5 (10 fc)

SoNowThen

#154
December 10, 2003, 01:01:14 PM
I just figured that if I ever have to shoot at a late magic hour outside, where I let it go for awhile and it's truly nearing dark, with only natural light, then I'd wanna use the fastest stock. Which would be 800t. But if I had to put a daylight conversion filter on the camera (or else it would be too blue), I'd have to rate it slower due to the loss of light from the filter, right?

Is there any 800D stock?
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

RegularKarate

#155
December 10, 2003, 01:18:16 PM
no 800 D that I'm aware of, but your conversion won't be too high because you're working in the later hour and have a lower color temp, so you're only gonna lose like 2/3 stop or so depending on the filter.

And you have a good amount of latitude to work with with the 800D... the #8 on that picture I posted is black at 4 and a 1/2 stops under and the #1 is blown out at 2 and a 1/2 stops over.

Maybe this should go in Tech Talk

SoNowThen

#156
December 10, 2003, 01:23:43 PM
Would you say that's an accurate skin tone represented?


What I really want is to just go out and shoot at night on the fly. Of course, street lights (where I live anyway) always end up looking shitty red colors. They need a streetlight-balanced stock  :) . But just imagine I was to go make a street documentary with no artificial lights. Besides super-fast lenses, what stocks would I need? Fuji, Kodak... also, isn't there a European stock called Agfa or something? I think Godard used a lot of that...
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

RegularKarate

#157
December 10, 2003, 01:39:14 PM
I'm not a real expert, but my experience (from what I've read and what I've shot) says Fuji is good for daylight exteriors and Kodak is better for everything else.

and if you're shooting at night, you're gonna need lights.

mutinyco

#158
December 10, 2003, 07:58:15 PM
You don't need 800 stock. You can easily probably get away with what you'd need even with Vision 200 and high-speed lenses. It's just that higher stocks have higher contrast. The 320 is nice too.

Minority Report used 800 for the surgery scene just to give the picture more grain.

But even a natural film like Elephant, with lots of daylight, was Vision 500T.

PS-Tungsten is 3200k.
"I believe in this, and it's been tested by research: he who fucks nuns will later join the church."

-St. Joe

nix

#159
December 28, 2003, 08:31:39 PM
It's been talked about enough, so I'll just say that this movie really affected me. It's one of the best of the year. Period.

This might have already been discussed but was the film cropped for 1:33:1 when you guys saw it? It seemed as though it was shot with that intention, but it was obviously shot on film and I remember seeing a preview for it and I don't think it was cropped then.

If it was done purposefully, I have my theories for why, but I'm just curious.
"Sex relieves stress, love causes it."
-Woddy Allen

SoNowThen

#160
December 29, 2003, 09:26:57 AM
It was shot and framed 1.33:1, yet I swear they (theatre) fucked it up when I saw it, and masked it (in projection??) for 1.85:1...
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

pete

#161
December 29, 2003, 12:30:17 PM
I saw it 1.33.  They shot it in that aspect ratio because they were convinced no one was going to watch it in the theaters.
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot."
- Buster Keaton

Jake_82

#162
December 31, 2003, 11:49:30 AM
I saw it 1.33:1 as well.. van sant said they shot it that way because they thought it would be more "majestic" and that it would seem like a high school educational video. The preview was cropped I believe... never saw it in theaters but online I saw two different versions, a 1.33:1 and another cropped to a wider ratio.
your reality is at the end of your dream

pete

#163
January 01, 2004, 01:22:37 AM
the october issue of american cinematographer had the DP saying it was because they didn't think anyone would watch it SO THERE.  nah I really don't care why it was 1.33.  it was a good article, they talked about those long and crazy shots and rehearsing for them and stuff.
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot."
- Buster Keaton

godardian

#164
January 01, 2004, 03:20:55 AM
Projection here was 1:33. It would be interesting to see it in the wrong aspect ratio, though. Kubrickian, chopping square to rectangle.
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

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