XIXAX Film Forum

The Director's Chair => Martin Scorsese => Topic started by: modage on May 18, 2003, 12:17:04 AM

Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: modage on May 18, 2003, 12:17:04 AM
i know this may be blasphemy to some, but speilberg had one and scorseses been around even longer so what is his worst/your least favorite of his movies?  personally i wasnt really too impressed with anything he did between 1980 and 1990 (although i havent seen After Hours yet), but everyone who is great seems to lose their way at some point.  why is that?
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: godardian on May 18, 2003, 12:53:46 AM
My personal least favorite: Bringing out the Dead. And even that I don't think is terrible. It's just noticeably below par, IMO.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Duck Sauce on May 18, 2003, 01:13:36 AM
Boxcar Bertha, sooo boring
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Holden Pike on May 18, 2003, 01:24:04 AM
Not counting Corman quickie Boxcar Bertha, for me the least of Marty's movies is The Color of Money. But even the least of his work I find to be better than most filmmaker's best, so it's all about perspective. I still don't think Scorsese has made a "bad" movie yet. And even Color of Money, it has some really fine stylistic touches, it's nicely understated, and the performances are all terrific. It just doesn't belong anywhere near the pantheon of his very best work.


And you've GOT to see After Hours ASAP. It's one of Scorsese's very best, and easily his most enjoyable flick (if you enjoy really dark comedies, that is).
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: godardian on May 18, 2003, 01:33:49 AM
Quote from: Holden Pike
But even the least of his work I find to be better than most filmmaker's best, so it's all about perspective. And you've GOT to see After Hours ASAP. It's one of Scorsese's very best, and easily his most enjoyable flick (if you enjoy really dark comedies, that is).


I agree with both statements.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Cecil on May 18, 2003, 01:34:26 AM
gangs, but i havent seen boxcar or colour.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: godardian on May 18, 2003, 01:51:02 AM
Quote from: cecil b. demented
gangs, but i havent seen boxcar or colour.


I've seen neither of those, nor New York, New York. Nor Kundun, for that matter.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: AlguienEstolamiPantalones on May 18, 2003, 01:11:08 PM
i would go with kundon
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: SoNowThen on May 18, 2003, 02:55:27 PM
Hmmm, I love all the ones you guys mentioned, except I haven't seen Boxcar, and never will. But even though this man is -- in my opinion -- the greatest director ever, I will say there is one movie I wish he never made:

CAPE FEAR


Fucking Spielberg produced it, and it made the most money of all Marty's movies (which is just plain wrong). And there's no reason for the man to do a remake. Fuck. But aside from this (and I've seen them all now), I don't think St Martin has ever made anything less than brilliant.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: godardian on May 18, 2003, 03:05:42 PM
Quote from: SoNowThen
Hmmm, I love all the ones you guys mentioned, except I haven't seen Boxcar, and never will. But even though this man is -- in my opinion -- the greatest director ever, I will say there is one movie I wish he never made:

CAPE FEAR


Fucking Spielberg produced it, and it made the most money of all Marty's movies (which is just plain wrong). And there's no reason for the man to do a remake. Fuck. But aside from this (and I've seen them all now), I don't think St Martin has ever made anything less than brilliant.


I dunno... I like his Cape Fear. I find myself constantly defending it, though; seems most people don't care for it, really. I think of it this way: Yes, it wasn't a necessary film to make. But there's enough creativity and personality in it that I'm very drawn in and I find it a really enjoyable experience. It bears much more of the director's style and personality than Psycho or Solaris did, so... even though it probably is a superflous film, I enjoy watching it. Scorsese brought something to it nobody else would have. He makes it his movie.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: AlguienEstolamiPantalones on May 18, 2003, 03:55:17 PM
Quote from: SoNowThen
Hmmm, I love all the ones you guys mentioned, except I haven't seen Boxcar, and never will. But even though this man is -- in my opinion -- the greatest director ever, I will say there is one movie I wish he never made:

CAPE FEAR


Fucking Spielberg produced it, and it made the most money of all Marty's movies (which is just plain wrong). And there's no reason for the man to do a remake. Fuck. But aside from this (and I've seen them all now), I don't think St Martin has ever made anything less than brilliant.


huh ?? that is one of the few movies that scared me .

i was never scared of what most people call scarey movies , all though " scarey movie 2" scared me

" ohh my god david cross is in this movie NOOOOOO Why do people cast this guy"

but i digress, cape fear was spooky because of how real it was . deniro  played the stalker pretty fucking scarey.

and i loved the fact that he had him have a chip on his shoulder about his white trash roots , made him all the more scarey
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: chainsmoking insomniac on May 19, 2003, 10:00:46 AM
Bringing Out the Dead
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: eward on May 19, 2003, 08:49:05 PM
new york, new york and his segment of new york stories was pretty fucking bad
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: MacGuffin on May 19, 2003, 09:50:09 PM
Quote from: eward
his segment of new york stories was pretty fucking bad


You must be confused. He directed "Life Lessons," not "Life With Zoe."
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Keener on May 19, 2003, 10:34:22 PM
Life Lessons was quite enjoyable. Very pleasant.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: ębrad on May 20, 2003, 11:05:12 AM
these 'worst movie' threads really suck.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: abbey road on May 20, 2003, 11:14:31 AM
i loved bringing out the dead, but i say after hours takes the cake, and color of moeny was lame, i mean y did he even want to do a sequal to the hustler, honestly?
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Gold Trumpet on May 20, 2003, 11:58:22 AM
First off, I must admit to never seeing Kundun, The Color of Money, Boxcar Bertha, and Cape Fear. Even with Scorsese, I am very willing and likely to pass up on a film of his I hear from the get go is average or not so good. Not enough time to see every movie.

With that, two films come up to mind right away in being pretty bad. Gangs of New York and King of Comedy. Gangs, unlike about every other Scorsese film I've seen, lacked the passion that makes Scorsese Scorsese. Then there are all the other complaints I've said time and time before about this movie which is very unfocused on the whole and more in love with the history of NYC at the time then making a film. The King of Comedy plays with as many ideas as a straightforward drama but is not one. Its a comedy and unlike the best comedies, it lacks the creativity of ideas and passion of being a comedy. It is one full idea drawn out to an unbelievable length that you wonder why you continued watching it after 15 minutes because of how so dull it makes the subject. The answer is hope which sometimes is only that.

~rougerum
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: SoNowThen on May 20, 2003, 12:19:31 PM
No no no no no, GT. Watch King Of Comedy again. It's all about celebrity and fame, and more uncomfortable comedy than anything, like a slightly surreal comedy of manners. And think about when it was written... it pre-dated a lot of the weird shit on tv nowadays, yet predicted so much of the fascination with weirdos who seem to get handed their 15 minutes of fame continually.

I think it's by far the most underrated Scorsese, maybe next to Bringing Out The Dead.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: SoNowThen on May 20, 2003, 12:25:49 PM
and to everybody else.... Color Of Money is great. Aaarrrghhh, this post is starting to piss me off...
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: godardian on May 20, 2003, 12:53:49 PM
Agree about King of Comedy- I place it with Network, Citizen Ruth, and American Psycho as Really Dark, Really Astute satire- but not about Bringing Out the Dead, which I just thought had too many flaws, too many scenes that didn't work. The "ghosts" made me roll my eyes. It was just too much.

But I'll admit I haven't seen it since its release. Maybe I'll make a double feature of that and Three Kings, just to re-confirm.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: SoNowThen on May 20, 2003, 01:21:13 PM
Yes!! That is one hell of an amazing movie night if you do that!!

1999 rocks.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Gold Trumpet on May 20, 2003, 01:46:05 PM
I'll think about watching King of Comedy again, but I think my disagreement about the film is not what people really think it is. Yes, I understand it comes off as a weird dark humor comedy, but still, it feels like it is dragging me along one small idea that should take up 15 minutes but has an hour and a half to it. I understand the realm of thought it deals with in looking to society and the power of TV, but it is one idea that seems stretched out by a plot very minimalistic in adding anything to that idea.

~rougerum
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: eward on May 20, 2003, 04:11:23 PM
i didnt like life lessons or life with zoe, i only liked oedipus wrecks....but that was a rare misstep from scorsese.  i love all his movies except that and new york, new york
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: abbey road on May 20, 2003, 06:34:35 PM
Quote from: SoNowThen
Yes!! That is one hell of an amazing movie night if you do that!!

1999 rocks.


i totally agree, my top 3 movies of all time: eyes wide shut, magnolia, and american beauty...1999 does rock!
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Ernie on May 20, 2003, 07:38:06 PM
Quote from: cbrad4d
these 'worst movie' threads really suck.


I know. They make me sad.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: soixante on May 20, 2003, 11:53:59 PM
My vote goes to Cape Fear.

I've always thought that King of Comedy, despite the title, is a drama.  I feel like it has a great first half, then runs out of energy in the second half, but the first half is so brilliant that I rate the movie highly overall.  And keep in mind, that film pretty much predicted the celebrity stalker culture that has become so prevalent today.

There's nothing wrong with examining both ends of the quality spectrum of directors we admire.  After all, even Orson Welles and Alfred Hitchcock  made weak films.  Shakespeare wrote a few bad plays -- scholars love to dump on Titus Andronicus.  Altman made Beyond Therapy.

I've done this exercise before, trying to determine what my LEAST favorite Beatle song is -- after all, I love a lot of their songs, but there are a few that suck -- Blue Jay Way, for example.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Duck Sauce on May 21, 2003, 12:05:03 AM
Quote from: cbrad4d
these 'worst movie' threads really suck.


Agreed, nothing good ever comes out of them, except when they go off topic
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: modage on May 21, 2003, 11:50:56 PM
Quote from: cbrad4d
these 'worst movie' threads really suck.


i actually think they can be just as interesting a topic as FAVORITE movie threads.  granted, they can be kind of a downer, especially if you're discussing one of your favorite directors shortcomings, but just as valid or interesting a topic.  its something that i cannot for the life of me figure out.
why is it that all great artists lose what makes them great at one point?
music, art,  movies, it seems like anyone who sticks around in their field long enough eventually stumbles, sometimes never to regain footing.  personally i feel like the 80s was not the creative zenith for scorsese.  and this could be due to A) lack of inspiration B) lack of good projects/scripts and C) personal issues, drugs divorce, etc.  but whatever the reason it may have seemed like he was washed up. and then BAM! 1990, Goodfellas comes out and proves that his best work may in fact still lie ahead of him.  or atleast something as good as his previous works.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: tpfkabi on June 14, 2003, 11:40:57 PM
Quote from: soixante
I've done this exercise before, trying to determine what my LEAST favorite Beatle song is -- after all, I love a lot of their songs, but there are a few that suck -- Blue Jay Way, for example.


Blue Jay Way is great. you must hate organs of the musical kind.

and i just got King of Comedy on DVD. i like it lots.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Ernie on June 14, 2003, 11:47:16 PM
Quote from: bigideas
Quote from: soixante
I've done this exercise before, trying to determine what my LEAST favorite Beatle song is -- after all, I love a lot of their songs, but there are a few that suck -- Blue Jay Way, for example.


Blue Jay Way is great. you must hate organs of the musical kind.

and i just got King of Comedy on DVD. i like it lots.


I still have to see that. It's one of the last ones I really have interest in seeing (of Scorsese's i mean) along with The Last Temptation of Christ. Maybe I'll see Boxcar Bertha and BOTD sooner of later but I don't know.

I have to support The Color of Money too, that is an awesome, underrated movie. After Hours and Alice Doesnt Live Here Anymore too...just criminally underrated fucking great movies they are.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Bud_Clay on August 30, 2003, 01:45:31 AM
Cape Fear:  Only Scorsese film I dislike, up to date.  I would say Bringing Out the Dead would be next in running.

You people who said Kundun are fucking crazy...
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: AlguienEstolamiPantalones on August 30, 2003, 02:18:28 AM
Quote from: soixante
My vote goes to Cape Fear.

.



i hope you didnt say that because it was his most popular money wise film, because pop or not he brought a lot to it

and thats the point quality pop culture, like the beatles were the number one band in the 60's them and motown ( and they were quality as well as comercial)

so pop or not  and they were still good, because that was before people like the ian mckaye's of the world deemed it un cool to be popular

thats dumb not to say you are dumb,  you might be a member of the short bus club for all i know ,

 but based on this post its not enough to have me insult you

just a question and a comment on my part
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Bud_Clay on August 30, 2003, 03:09:27 AM
He's completely justified in saying Cape Fear is his least favorite.  What does the commercial success have to do with anything?  That means absolutely nothing.

I grow sick of people assuming one's disliking of a film is due to it being "mainstream".
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: AlguienEstolamiPantalones on August 30, 2003, 03:37:11 AM
Quote from: Ghoulardi's Idol
He's completely justified in saying Cape Fear is his least favorite.  What does the commercial success have to do with anything?  That means absolutely nothing.

I grow sick of people assuming one's disliking of a film is due to it being "mainstream".


all i said was i hope that , that is not the reason outside of that he is missing the boat because that is a sick great film, deniro should go down in history as the scareiest human being to ever live ( no ironic jokes about jack black in i still know what you did last summer)

deniro was a real person, and he scared me then and now, he is that fucker we see on on the local news

its a great film , and to say kundun is better,  to me is comical but everyone has the right to be stupid errr i mean the right to have their own opinions.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: cine on August 30, 2003, 09:46:07 AM
Too many of you have not seen New York New York and I think thats one of the reasons people are saying this kinda thread sucks. Too many people are disregarding films they HAVEN'T seen of the director and basing it on films they HAVE. Big mistake. How many of you voted for Cape Fear without mentioning seeing New York, New York or not? Really, I think Scorsese would shit himself if he discovered you thought Cape Fear was his worst movie over the all-around awful De Niro/Minnelli picture.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: eward on August 30, 2003, 10:55:38 AM
Quote from: Cinephile
Too many of you have not seen New York New York and I think thats one of the reasons people are saying this kinda thread sucks. Too many people are disregarding films they HAVEN'T seen of the director and basing it on films they HAVE. Big mistake. How many of you voted for Cape Fear without mentioning seeing New York, New York or not? Really, I think Scorsese would shit himself if he discovered you thought Cape Fear was his worst movie over the all-around awful De Niro/Minnelli picture.


yeah i didn't like new york, new york either.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Vile5 on August 30, 2003, 02:54:32 PM
i liked it, maybe i didn't like all the movie but it has something that i really liked it, can't explain...
and my vote goes to The Color of Money, i don't think is a bad movie but i think it could be better, knowing how good is Scorsese.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Ghostboy on August 30, 2003, 05:11:22 PM
I haven't seen New York New York or The Color Of Money, but I think every other film he's made has been more successful, at least on a storytelling scale, than 'Gangs Of New York.'  Like everyone else, I wouldn't call any of his movies bad, but that one is -- to me -- the most highly flawed.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Gamblour. on August 30, 2003, 05:49:22 PM
Cape Fear all the way...I'm sorry, but Robert de Niro, Southerners do not sound like that. His accent alone ruined the entire movie for me, I just couldn't get it into it. I actually fast-forwarded through it. For a real Southern accent, listen to Harlan Pepper.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Weak2ndAct on August 30, 2003, 05:54:44 PM
It amuses me how people say that Cape Fear is "commercial" or "mainstream," like Marty made some cop-out Hollywood thriller.  The version that Spielberg wanted to to make DEFINITELY would have been that.  Best example: the scene in drama class.  Spielberg had it as a chase/escape scene.  Scorsese gives us the seduction.  I can't honestly think of anything more terrifying that DeNiro shoving his thumb back in Lewis' mouth.

Besides that, you get face-biting, Joe Don Baker's horrific demise and messy aftermath, incredibly flawed protagonists, threatened rape at every turn, near-head smashing, and other mainstream fun.  There's no doubt in my mind that Hitchcock would have been making a movie like this today, and Scorsese did his best to emulate it (Herrmann music, Bass titles, Whitlock effects-- christ he even used the same production designer!).  It's success lies in being a great, ballsy thriller that scared the crap out of people, just like the Master used to.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Bud_Clay on August 30, 2003, 06:26:18 PM
Quote from: Cinephile
Too many of you have not seen New York New York and I think thats one of the reasons people are saying this kinda thread sucks. Too many people are disregarding films they HAVEN'T seen of the director and basing it on films they HAVE. Big mistake. How many of you voted for Cape Fear without mentioning seeing New York, New York or not? Really, I think Scorsese would shit himself if he discovered you thought Cape Fear was his worst movie over the all-around awful De Niro/Minnelli picture.


No I'll admit it, I haven't seen New York New York.  I've probably only seen half of the films Scorsese has made.  One of the reasons Cape Fear presses on as such a disappointment with me though is because that was the film right after Goodfellas...and to me, that is one of the top best films ever made..certainly Scorsese's best film.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: AlguienEstolamiPantalones on August 31, 2003, 11:18:55 AM
Quote from: Gamblor
Cape Fear all the way...I'm sorry, but Robert de Niro, Southerners do not sound like that. His accent alone ruined the entire movie for me, I just couldn't get it into it. I actually fast-forwarded through it. For a real Southern accent, listen to Harlan Pepper.


im sorry deniro does not go into a project blind he did some research and took from differnt sources and created this SCAREY And all to real Lone person, the whole south is not like him, but their is people like that all over the world

and bobby deniro does his research hard, and never goes in blind even in rocky and bullwinkle he was doing a dead on impersanation of the president of Macedonia
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Gamblour. on August 31, 2003, 01:41:43 PM
Quote from: AlguienEstolamiPantalones

im sorry deniro does not go into a project blind he did some research and took from differnt sources and created this SCAREY And all to real Lone person, the whole south is not like him, but their is people like that all over the world

and bobby deniro does his research hard, and never goes in blind even in rocky and bullwinkle he was doing a dead on impersanation of the president of Macedonia


Don't get me wrong, De Niro is one of my favorite actors, and I know he's great at method acting, but I just think he was wrong for the role because of his poor accent. It sounded so forced, like a bad southern belle impression.

And Cinephile, no I haven't seen New York, New York, or Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore, or After Hours, or the Color of Money, or Casino, Kundun, or the Age of Innocence, or the King of Comedy, but since this is an opinion post, it doesn't matter that we haven't seen all of his movies, just that one of them is our least favorite.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: AntiDumbFrogQuestion on August 31, 2003, 11:13:56 PM
king of comedy wudn't so bad. the only problem was they tried to repeat the Media Mogul ending of Taxi Driver, and I was left wondering where the fuck Jerry Lewis went after seeing Rupert on TV.
Almost 20 years later he was on Conan, and that's the last I ever saw of him! It was kinda creepy actually
But all in all, worst film?
Oof, because of Patricia Arquette's lack on any onscreen chemistry between her then-partner, Bring Out the Dead.
Oh, and the ghosts coming out of the street. That was kinda corny.
And any use of Blue Screen for that matter. Looks corny.
But the part that made me go "eh" was when the one guy in the band took the drug that was going around and his other bandmate was like "this sucks! we just got signed!" Cutesy and corny to the max, and not at ALL realistic. That part sucked.

But fuckin Marc Anthony with a baseball bat? Cuttin himself!? And The Clash playing while an emergency vehicle sped around New York?!?! There were some good parts to this movie!

Though I aint seen NewYork, NewYork, or the recently mentioned Cape Fear, or Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore, or Color of Money or....I'll get to 'em!
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: filmcritic on August 31, 2003, 11:17:47 PM
I actually really liked "Bringing Out the Dead". Although it probably could have been called "Ambulance Driver".
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: cine on September 01, 2003, 08:23:18 PM
That would've been a stupid title.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: jwebb202 on March 29, 2004, 11:39:22 PM
got to go with cape fear

a horrible remake
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: SiliasRuby on March 31, 2004, 03:10:55 PM
Quote from: jwebb202
got to go with cape fear

a horrible remake

I totally agree.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Pubrick on March 31, 2004, 08:23:44 PM
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I totally agree.

really? i never would have guessed you would say that..
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I agree with all three of you, especially you Neon...
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I Agree.
Quote from: SiliasRuby
Yep, a fantastic opening sequence
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I agree, but I think it's Kaufman's best movie SO FAR
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I agree
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I totally agree with you there
Quote from: SiliasRuby
Sounds good to me.
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I totally agree, with what she has to say.
Quote from: SiliasRuby
That makes Three of us
Quote from: SiliasRuby
Damn Strait.
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I totally agree
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I know exactly what you mean.
Quote from: SiliasRuby
Nice, Very Nice.
Quote from: SiliasRuby
lol
Quote from: SiliasRuby
I am hoping this is going to be at least 75% decent.... pubrick note: what in the HELL does this even mean??

do u agree?
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: ono on March 31, 2004, 08:30:09 PM
Quote from: Pubrick
Quote from: SiliasRuby
Damn Strait.

Wow, how long did it take you to do that?  Either way, I thought he was referring to the Strait of Gibraltar there.  That thing is such a nuisance.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: Pubrick on March 31, 2004, 08:31:52 PM
Quote from: Onomatopoeia
Wow, how long did it take you to do that?

several weeks.
Title: Worst Scorsese Film?
Post by: ono on March 31, 2004, 08:36:16 PM
Ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer.  Heh.