The Brown Bunny

Started by meatwad, May 09, 2003, 07:49:32 PM

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godardian

Quote from: SantaClauseWasA BlackManall extreme is bad , extreme right and extreme left

in a perfect world both would be not a issue to deal with

the world is not perfect

and in the end i would rather have a hardcord republican then a hardcore democrat


a hardcore p.c freak would let us get taken over by a real scumbag

and i know people like you want to call george bush hitler

but he is no hitler, and the real hitler was a very bad man

a man whos evil you could never imagine, and that reason is people like george bush help rid the earth of this shit

you think you are being opressed under bush go ask somone who lived under the taliban

you and me would not be allowed to have this debate if we did nor would we know how

Yet again, your limited, binary thinking renders you incapable of really holding up your end of a discussion/argument. It all degenerates into easy category vs. easy category: Conservative/liberal, p.c./non-p.c., cool/uncool, positive/negative.

P.C. is just a stupid sound-byte buzzword; the actual idea hardly exists in the world today, other than on an ever-shrinking number of college campuses and as a red herring in the minds of people who identify as conservative and, because of the defensiveness from which their views spring, always have and always will feel under siege and beleaguered by people who don't share their values, and have nostalgia for things (like so-called "traditional family values" and American infallibility) that never existed in the first place.

You're constantly insisting that "people like (insert whoever you're disputing with today)" have no power in the world." Well, the city and region I live in (Seattle, Pacific NW) are very, very anti-war and progressive, socially and economically. Sure, we feel the effects of Bush here (the economy's shit, for one thing), but in the world I live in every day, anti-Bush values are lived, celebrated, and reflected by our representatives and in the lawbooks. And that's true everywhere. If you're only talking about the power to force a war, then Bush does have power, but it certainly doesn't mean nobody else has any influence on the way things are run in their communities or to try to change the course of things on a national level. You do, indeed, sound like a fucking fascist when you go on about that.

You're as provincial as they come, but you're a loud, loud ranter and screamer who seems to believe belligerence and pettiness is the way to convince people you're right. You're this message board's very own Rush Limbaugh.
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

SoNowThen

I'm totally jumping into this with no prior reading, but here goes:

when Santa says that living under Bush is much better than living under taliban, you gotta agree there. We are very fortunate to be in north america where we are at the very least not subject to death squads when we voice our opinions. And every board needs their Rush Limbaugh.

I don't really care either way, but it's nice to have someone else take all the heat for being a "right wing facist". Usually that's what people accuse me of.  :) :)
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

godardian

Quote from: SoNowThenI'm totally jumping into this with no prior reading, but here goes:

when Santa says that living under Bush is much better than living under taliban, you gotta agree there. We are very fortunate to be in north america where we are at the very least not subject to death squads when we voice our opinions.

I totally agree, but I think my approach to being a North American is one of gratitude and feeling fortunate. I think Bush and his ilk are more about entitlement, as if we all "deserved" to be born privileged North Americans, and it's not just random, and we might not just as easily have been born poor in a war-torn country. Certainly, he's not as bad as the Taliban. I do think some of his views are barbaric, but I don't think he would ever try to go about enforcing them the way the Taliban did. I never said he was that bad. I just said that Santa seems to lack the basic skills of articulation to back up all the hasty, disproportionate claims he's always making.

There aren't death squads, but the powers that be find other ways to try to shut dissenters up... it would take a lot, a whole lot, for it ever to get Taliban-bad here, but remember McCarthyism? That was only two generations ago, in a similarly fear-ridden, us-or-them milieu.

Edit:  It's also helpful to remember that the Taliban was armed by a very popular Republican administration.
""Money doesn't come into it. It never has. I do what I do because it's all that I am." - Morrissey

"Lacan stressed more and more in his work the power and organizing principle of the symbolic, understood as the networks, social, cultural, and linguistic, into which a child is born. These precede the birth of a child, which is why Lacan can say that language is there from before the actual moment of birth. It is there in the social structures which are at play in the family and, of course, in the ideals, goals, and histories of the parents. This world of language can hardly be grasped by the newborn and yet it will act on the whole of the child's existence."

Stay informed on protecting your freedom of speech and civil rights.

SoNowThen

Re: McCarthy.
Very true. Happily, things seemed to turn around pretty well over that whole thing, and like you said, just two generations later people are already realizing all the shit that went down.

I just wanted to put my two cents in, anyway. I had no real intelligent point to make.

But really, we need another McCarthy soon, so we can blacklist Susan Sarandon. Just for the fact that she annoys me. Basically I should just be allowed to say who gets to work in movies. I think I would like that. You'd see a lot more Monica Bellucci, and a lot less Rebecca Pigeon. Yeah, I can see it now...
Those who say that the totalitarian state of the Soviet Union was not "real" Marxism also cannot admit that one simple feature of Marxism makes totalitarianism necessary:  the rejection of civil society. Since civil society is the sphere of private activity, its abolition and replacement by political society means that nothing private remains. That is already the essence of totalitarianism; and the moralistic practice of the trendy Left, which regards everything as political and sometimes reveals its hostility to free speech, does nothing to contradict this implication.

When those who hated capital and consumption (and Jews) in the 20th century murdered some hundred million people, and the poster children for the struggle against international capitalism and America are now fanatical Islamic terrorists, this puts recent enthusiasts in an awkward position. Most of them are too dense and shameless to appreciate it, and far too many are taken in by the moralistic and paternalistic rhetoric of the Left.

Sleuth

This just might be the next Donnie Darko thread (or did the God thread already take that title?)
I like to hug dogs

Sal

imdb:
Vincent Gallo, who was derided at Cannes by numerous critics for his road movie The Brown Bunny, has denied that he ever apologized for the movie and called film critic Roger Ebert "a fat pig" for writing that he did. The "apology" was included in a number of other reports filed from Cannes during last month's festival. "I never apologized for anything in my life," Gallo said Monday. This week's Village Voice, in an article by Mark Peranson, backs Gallo, observing that his remarks at a news conference in Cannes were taken out of context as he "sank into ironic self-hatred." Gallo's actual remarks were: "This is a place where merchandise or tangible objects are brought and sold to be marketed as entertainment throughout the world. ... I made one of these things that's supposed to entertain people. To criticize a movie because it's unsuccessful in that purpose, I accept that. They're right. If no one wants to see the movie then it's a disastrous film and a waste of time. And I apologize to the financiers." Peranson points out that "with all this publicity, you can't say nobody wants to see The Brown Bunny."

EL__SCORCHO

EBert's site:
But was Gallo actually misquoted?

"Absolutely insane stuff from Gallo," editor Colin Brown assured me. "Not only is everything we wrote in Cannes exactly as he spewed out, word for word, it was all recorded on audio tape." He added, "It makes me wonder whether this is not all some great marketing ploy on his part. I have actually come across people who say 'Brown Bunny' is top of their list of films they most want to see out of Cannes this year."

ono

From http://www.suntimes.com/output/eb-feature/cst-ftr-ebert04.html

Quote from: Roger EbertDuring a scene where Gallo shares a bicycle with a young woman, I became so nostalgic for "Butch Cassidy" that I softly sang "Raindrops Keep Fallin' on My Head." I stopped after six words when my wife jabbed me in the ribs. I was overheard by a writer for Hollywood Reporter, who included it in his coverage about how badly the film was received, and that is another reason Gallo has put the heebie-jeebie on my colon and prostate. I am not too worried. I had a colonoscopy once, and they let me watch it on TV. It was more entertaining than "The Brown Bunny."
Let it be known now and forevermore that this is why I LOVE Ebert.  :-D

Jeremy Blackman

Quote from: godardianP.C. is just a stupid sound-byte buzzword; the actual idea hardly exists in the world today, other than on an ever-shrinking number of college campuses and as a red herring in the minds of people who identify as conservative and, because of the defensiveness from which their views spring, always have and always will feel under siege and beleaguered by people who don't share their values, and have nostalgia for things (like so-called "traditional family values" and American infallibility) that never existed in the first place.

Thank you thank you thank you.

Santa... if by PC you mean saying "Native American" instead of "Indian" ... then live with it. All Native Americans deserve to be called Native Americans, for obvious reasons. If you're complaining about people saying "African American" instead of "Black" or "person" instead of "man"... then I would say the same thing. These are basics of respect that our society has neglected.

I will admit that PC becomes "evil" when it becomes censorship, but you should have no complaints about people who go out of their way to irrigate years of racism, sexism, and ignorance out of their everyday language.

Quote from: SoNowThenwhen Santa says that living under Bush is much better than living under taliban, you gotta agree there.

But most people who were oppressed under the Taliban knew that they were being oppressed...

modage

wait.  i just thought of something.  what is the PC term for black people who live in other countries?
Christopher Nolan's directive was clear to everyone in the cast and crew: Use CGI only as a last resort.

MrBurgerKing

Quote from: themodernage02wait.  i just thought of something.  what is the PC term for black people who live in other countries?

Just replace American with the other country. African Japanese, African Mongolian, African Italian, African Russian, African Indian, and African African.

What do they call a whopper in japan?

AlguienEstolamiPantalones

Quote from: Jeremy BlackmanI will admit that PC becomes "evil" when it becomes censorship

...


then why censor my posts ??? which you just did , should the bad not go with the great

its not all nice and kind sometimes things get rough, why should anyone tamper with history

in years from now people will want to read what i said here , before i become the worlds most famous mambo judo master

MrBurgerKing

I don't find the ebert quote funny because he will never be skinny. At such an old age it's almost impossible to shed all those pounds. At least Churchill said it right because he will actually sober up the next morning.

Jeremy Blackman

Quote from: SantaClauseWasA BlackManthen why censor my posts ??? which you just did , should the bad not go with the great

I'm impressed that you knew it was me.

Why did I remove your post? It was a personal attack.

AlguienEstolamiPantalones

Quote from: Jeremy Blackman
Quote from: SantaClauseWasA BlackManthen why censor my posts ??? which you just did , should the bad not go with the great

I'm impressed that you knew it was me.

Why did I remove your post? It was a personal attack.

of course it was you, but that is not a slam on you

some people found it very funny