30 Rock (esteemed winner of the 30 Rock vs. Studio 60 deathmatch)

Started by ono, September 18, 2006, 08:00:42 PM

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pete

Quote from: Losing the Horse: on September 19, 2006, 04:38:58 PM
Quote from: pete on September 19, 2006, 12:06:51 PM
aaron sorkin is the ron howard of TV.

That's a terribly unfair comparison.  Sorkin's crack cocaine addiction is enough to distinguish him from Howard, and the first season of West Wing is enough to seperate them entirely.  West Wing was a show, along with The Sopranos, that reminded the audience of the potential for smart programs.  Sorkin may have lost his touch, I didn't catch Studio 60, but he at least once had a touch.

smart shows are all over the place.  they're just either comedies or on hbo.
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot."
- Buster Keaton

w/o horse

Quote from: pete on September 19, 2006, 05:46:29 PM
Quote from: Losing the Horse: on September 19, 2006, 04:38:58 PM
Quote from: pete on September 19, 2006, 12:06:51 PM
aaron sorkin is the ron howard of TV.

That's a terribly unfair comparison.  Sorkin's crack cocaine addiction is enough to distinguish him from Howard, and the first season of West Wing is enough to seperate them entirely.  West Wing was a show, along with The Sopranos, that reminded the audience of the potential for smart programs.  Sorkin may have lost his touch, I didn't catch Studio 60, but he at least once had a touch.

smart shows are all over the place.  they're just either comedies or on hbo.

Yeah agreed.  But I'm saying that smart shows weren't all over the place in 1999.  And, regardless, the first season of The West Wing holds up.
Raven haired Linda and her school mate Linnea are studying after school, when their desires take over and they kiss and strip off their clothes. They take turns fingering and licking one another's trimmed pussies on the desks, then fuck each other to intense orgasms with colorful vibrators.

grand theft sparrow

I hate Amanda Peet and Matthew Perry with a passion.  But I liked them in this show.  It figures that it takes a drama in order for Perry to finally be funny and I could kiss the director for making sure that Peet's horse-face, low-rent Julia Roberts smile is nowhere to be found.  And the chemistry between Perry and Bradley Whitford worked for me.  I completely buy them as long-time writing partners.

I've never seen The West Wing or Sports Night or anything else Aaron Sorkin has done besides A Few Good Men, but I liked this show so much, I'm going to go back and check both those shows out.  I'm pretty much with Bethie on this one.

OrHowILearnedTo

I thought the show was okay and I'll probably watch again this monday, but two things really pissed me off. First was Amanda Peet's teeth :shock:. The second is being that it's a pilot and it was only so-so as hour long dramas go, I don't think it warranted that many damn commercial breaks!

pete

wow, so bad.
it was nonstop network sitcom-quality punchilnes shot like ER.  every bit character had two scenes in the show 1) beef with the two dudes and 2) the apology, as if that creates some kinda "arc" which is what is destroying everything good known to civilization these days.  either way, terrible materials delivered with the most embarassingly ernest and hackneyed self-importance.  the show climaxed with a ripoff of the Looney Tuney theme which in itself was a ripoff of the Animaniacs theme, with crane shots flying every direction, and those crazy sophiscated "shot within a shot" deals that kept the monitors in frame.  and somehow that was considered "cutting-edge comedy."
  the writers room bit was funny though, with a bunch of writers trying to be funny.  and, just as she is in the movies, amanda peet is only as good as whoever her character is fucking.
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot."
- Buster Keaton

Ravi

Yeah, its hard to care about what's going on.  The ratings fall or some rich people get fired or a sketch doesn't make it on the air.  So what?  I'm willing to give it a chance, but I'm skeptical.

ono

wow, so good.

pete, there already is a Ron Howard of television.  His name is Ron Howard, and he was partly responsible for Arrested Development, which, while it is no Curb, was pretty decent.  That, there, along with your lauding of Entourage, has pretty much invalidated most of what you've said.  Why are you watching anyway if you hated it so much the first time around?  The song wasn't Animaniacs, or Looney Tunes.  It was Gilbert and Sullivan, and was perfect in fitting the bill for what was needed given the circumstances.

If Sorkin should be compared to anyone, it would be David Mamet.  He knows words, he knows rhythm.  He's a classical writer who does one key thing extremely well and a whole bunch of little supporting things that most people don't even notice, but make his writing WORK.  So many scenes -- from the press conference, to the exchange with Matt and Harriet, to Jordan's meeting with sales and affiliates and then later Jack, to the exchange between Danny and Simon, bringing their tension to a boil -- were all just pitch perfect.  The only weak note, I'd say, was the prayer circle.  It was a little off tone for the episode, for the environment.

modage

ron howard didnt create arrested development.  mitchell hurwitz did, howard just produced it.  and it will remain 1000x a better funnier show than this will ever be.  the melodrama was a little thick with perry and paulson when the strings and piano started playing.  its only episode 2, can we atleast save that stuff for when we care about these people.  and yeah it does seem a little self involved in the same way entourage is made for hollywood actors and hangers-on, this is made for people in tv.  it also seems like a total fantasy as far as amanda peets brash network president willing to fight for good tv and sarah paulsons religious hilarious star.  these things dont exist, except in writers minds.  if this is the best new show this season than its a pretty awful season.  the show is ok but put it next to LOST or Arrested Development and it's really not that funny or that involving.  i'll stick with it a little longer, because as tv proves, its easy to get hooked on anything.
Christopher Nolan's directive was clear to everyone in the cast and crew: Use CGI only as a last resort.

ono

That's fine, because this is not supposed to be a comedy.  It's a drama about the behind the scenes goings on of a sketch comedy show.  And Lost is pretty bad.  Please don't compare this to Lost.  Ever.

Peet is Jamie Tarses, Paulson is an ex-girlfriend of Sorkin's.  Christine something.  They're real people, and yeah, it's insider, but at least the people are likable, unlike Entourage.  So it's got that going for it.  Don't require that people are likable always.  I love to hate Jack on this show, already.

Didn't say Howard created AD, just that he was partly responsible for it.  And producers DO do a lot more than is known, especially in television.

Pubrick

under the paving stones.

ono

Hardly, P.  The first season was pretty great, I was one of its biggest fans, but the second season brought us the horridness of Ana Lucia and Michael (MY BOOOY!)  The Lost writers would like for us to believe they know where they're going, but instead of answering questions, they keep on introducing new ones with no hope of things ever making any sense.

But, back to Studio 60.

MacGuffin

"Don't think about making art, just get it done. Let everyone else decide if it's good or bad, whether they love it or hate it. While they are deciding, make even more art." - Andy Warhol


Skeleton FilmWorks

polkablues

Quote from: pete on September 25, 2006, 10:04:04 PM
the show climaxed with a ripoff of the Looney Tuney theme which in itself was a ripoff of the Animaniacs theme

Um... besides ono, is everyone else just letting this slide?
My house, my rules, my coffee

matt35mm

Quote from: polkablues on September 26, 2006, 01:25:23 AM
Quote from: pete on September 25, 2006, 10:04:04 PM
the show climaxed with a ripoff of the Looney Tuney theme which in itself was a ripoff of the Animaniacs theme

Um... besides ono, is everyone else just letting this slide?

Uh... the correction only had to be made once, I thought.

Pete, rent Topsy-Turvy, reverse your chronology and check your spelling.  Problem solved, perfection achieved.

The show's okay.  I'm also leaning towards not that impressed, but none of it is bad.  Yes, Sorkin has a knack for rhythm in dialogue, but for the most part, he's doing only and exactly what's expected of him, which is more of the same more of the same.  If next week is more of the same then I'm gonna stop watching, but I will give it next week.

pete

yeah I'm not hip with song numbers, but that song still sucked.

Quote from: onomabracadabra on September 25, 2006, 10:33:34 PM
wow, so good.

pete, there already is a Ron Howard of television. His name is Ron Howard, and he was partly responsible for Arrested Development, which, while it is no Curb, was pretty decent. That, there, along with your lauding of Entourage, has pretty much invalidated most of what you've said. Why are you watching anyway if you hated it so much the first time around? The song wasn't Animaniacs, or Looney Tunes. It was Gilbert and Sullivan, and was perfect in fitting the bill for what was needed given the circumstances.

If Sorkin should be compared to anyone, it would be David Mamet. He knows words, he knows rhythm. He's a classical writer who does one key thing extremely well and a whole bunch of little supporting things that most people don't even notice, but make his writing WORK. So many scenes -- from the press conference, to the exchange with Matt and Harriet, to Jordan's meeting with sales and affiliates and then later Jack, to the exchange between Danny and Simon, bringing their tension to a boil -- were all just pitch perfect. The only weak note, I'd say, was the prayer circle. It was a little off tone for the episode, for the environment.

but yeah, he brings none of the tension to a boil.  a character gets mad at another character, then five scenes later, they say sorry to each other with a lot of empty words and references to the show.  you defend the show as drama that isn't supposed to funny but they try to squeeze like one zinger for every three lines of dialogue spoken.  I always acknowledged entourage as a trashy glitzy show, but it's way more interesting to watch than this one.  I don't know who in this show is likable, everyone walks around like a pissed off customer claiming it's his or her right to demand a full refund on a broken bicycle. 
"Tragedy is a close-up; comedy, a long shot."
- Buster Keaton