Author Topic: Manchester by the Sea  (Read 3083 times)

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Jeremy Blackman

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Re: Manchester by the Sea
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2017, 07:01:41 PM »
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Spoilers...

I get that. But I really don't think I was supposed to have the reaction that I had. I rapidly started losing interest in the movie. When Lee finally decided not to be his guardian, it was a total anticlimax.

I'm more than comfortable with realistic, flawed characters. I think the movie cheats a bit by not letting us see the consequences that Patrick will inevitably face. And you can't tell me we're not supposed to find his antics at least a little cute.

Patrick's love triangle feels more like a fantasy than anything resembling realism. I was surprised how many times they put a button on it — like, did we really need to see those girls knocking on the car window and giggling over him? "Are those your girlfriends too?" / "They wish." The last section of the movie kind of starts draining the realism from the flawless first half.
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Drenk

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Re: Manchester by the Sea
« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2017, 07:30:53 PM »
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SPOILERS

Yes, I don't remember if the second girlfriends knows about the other girl, but she must, right? About the consequences: I've learned from my friends, who are intelligent young women, that boys can do pretty much every thing they want to them without facing much consequences—but it's just my experience, that's why it didn't break the realism of the movie for me. And it is shown as a quirk most than anything. But a somewhat successful hockey player who is popular with girls and cheating with his official girlfriend doesn't strike me as fantasy; I'd even say that the fact that the movie doesn't see the situation as exceptional is what makes it real. How easy things happen.

I'm sorry it took you out of the movie, the scene where he says "I can't beat it" goes beyond Patrick.
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Jeremy Blackman

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Re: Manchester by the Sea
« Reply #17 on: January 28, 2017, 08:08:00 PM »
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To keep this in perspective, I'm complaining about a movie that I liked. And I'm probably holding it to an unfairly high standard.

Patrick says the girls don't know about each other. The way he doesn't face consequences just makes him more annoying, and not in a particularly fun way. But I think it is supposed to be fun. Recall the scenes with the mom almost catching them. Almost indistinguishable from an American Pie movie. The mom's behavior didn't particularly make sense, either.
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samsong

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Re: Manchester by the Sea
« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2017, 01:21:42 PM »
+1
one of the film's most invaluable virtues is its expression of the symbiotic relationship between humor and sadness, comedy and tragedy.  i can't think of a movie that does this more completely and poignantly than this.  maybe secrets & lies

it's also important to take the setting into account.  most behavioral anomalies, i chalked up as massachusetts specific idiosyncrasies.  which isn't to say anything was confounding and that the only way to explain it is to shrug one's shoulders and say, "that must be how they are out there."  it's all still very much in keeping with general human behavior.  as portrayed in the film, there's a lax attitude towards teenagers having sex amongst certain families in manchester, and i don't think it's a far-fetched idea that this is true in, you know, other parts of the world.  i don't think the scene with the mother "almost catching them" was about that at all.  it's pretty obvious what's going on and she clearly knows, she just isn't going to flip out about it.  kids always think they're getting away with shit that parents can see right through.  this is very true to life to me.

also patrick's behavior in the wake of his dad's passing is a bit unsettling but also probably very true to life.  life doesn't stop because you lose someone, and in the case of a teenage boy, he's still gonna just want to hang out with friends and try to get it in.  his grief is private, almost undetectable, but that's how it is with some people.  others are consumed by it.  others lash out.  i really don't think any of the behavior displayed in this movie is ever strange or disingenuous to be beyond understanding.  one just needs a little empathy.

all i can really say jeremy is that your reaction to the particular details you got hung up on are completely your own, and on you.  you and everyone in the world are entitled to react to whatever it is in a movie however you like, but that isn't always the fault of the work itself.  in this instance it's simply a reality of the character that he's a teenage mass-hole jock who is playing around with two girls, and neither of them know about it, or maybe they do.  why is this so far from reality to you is beyond me.  you aren't seeing the woods for the trees.

Jeremy Blackman

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Re: Manchester by the Sea
« Reply #19 on: January 29, 2017, 05:03:39 PM »
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Again, I want to emphasize that these are relatively minor complaints. I just find it interesting to talk about them.

as portrayed in the film, there's a lax attitude towards teenagers having sex amongst certain families in manchester

Sure, that's fine. The first girlfriend's parents did not have that attitude, though.

i don't think the scene with the mother "almost catching them" was about that at all.  it's pretty obvious what's going on and she clearly knows, she just isn't going to flip out about it.  kids always think they're getting away with shit that parents can see right through.  this is very true to life to me.

I meant to say "interrupt" rather than "catch." So here's what I was getting at. I sincerely don't understand what she's trying to accomplish by messing with them. The coincidence of her interrupting them to complain about Lee (when they were just about to start) felt way too wacky for this movie.

(The obvious explanation is that she does that to create a funny scene for us.)

If she tacitly approves but is not entirely comfortable with it, why would she be constantly going to her daughter's room to put herself in that uncomfortable situation? Is she grappling with the reality and acting out because she doesn't know what to do? Maybe.

On the other hand, if she is comfortable with them having sex, just leave them alone. Does she get some kind of perverted thrill out of interrupting them? Those scenes are kind of dumb. This is what I'm talking about when I say the first half was perfect and powerful, then the movie wanders and gets less incisive as it experiments.

also patrick's behavior in the wake of his dad's passing is a bit unsettling but also probably very true to life.

I loved many of the scenes with him acting out or freaking out, especially the scene with the freezer. The only behavior of his that actually unsettles me was present before his dad's death (being a pathological liar to his 2 girlfriends). The only thing that solves that is cultural relativism. Which is a perfectly valid choice to make when watching a movie.

your reaction to the particular details you got hung up on are completely your own, and on you.  you and everyone in the world are entitled to react to whatever it is in a movie however you like, but that isn't always the fault of the work itself.

I basically agree. It probably comes down to this: The first half (or even 2/3) is the kind of movie I love and wanted to see. The second part, not as much.
"Hunger is the purest sin"

 

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